Iced Earth

James B. wrote:

Wrecked Neck wrote:

James?

You are correct
The Patriot Act allows detaining terrorists indefinitely without formal charges or trial.

I would think he'd be in Federal custody already if that was the case?
Some jurisdictions have city, county, state , and federal holding in the same facility? Do not the case in Indiana.

gotcha. I will grab some popcorn and watch this unfold.

What if he got transferred to the Guantanamo detention facility?

Quite frankly if they are not going to charge him then they need to release him. This whole 'armed rebellion' narrative where there are no arms is silly.

I'm not going to get into all the political debate, but even though Century Media have dropped them, the entire Iced Earth catalog, including, strangely enough, The Dark Saga, is on Spotify and Youtube music.

It seems like some people think he’s worse than Charles Manson. I remember when guys like Phil Anselmo and Axl Rose proudly praised Manson in public by wearing his shirt. Go figure...

Many Fools on Blabbermouth would probably defend a serial killer but have never ending contempt for a right wing person. I know Jon’s actions were a mistake, but I know he doesn’t deserve the level of hate he gets. I do not believe he killed anyone with bear spray.

Troublezone wrote:

It seems like some people think he’s worse than Charles Manson. I remember when guys like Phil Anselmo and Axl Rose proudly praised Manson in public by wearing his shirt. Go figure...

Many Fools on Blabbermouth would probably defend a serial killer but have never ending contempt for a right wing person. I know Jon’s actions were a mistake, but I know he doesn’t deserve the level of hate he gets. I do not believe he killed anyone with bear spray.

The reaction is indeed way too exaggerated.

Gilbert wrote:

Troublezone wrote:

It seems like some people think he’s worse than Charles Manson. I remember when guys like Phil Anselmo and Axl Rose proudly praised Manson in public by wearing his shirt. Go figure...

Many Fools on Blabbermouth would probably defend a serial killer but have never ending contempt for a right wing person. I know Jon’s actions were a mistake, but I know he doesn’t deserve the level of hate he gets. I do not believe he killed anyone with bear spray.

The reaction is indeed way too exaggerated.

Everyone on both sides are/were enraged about the policies of the opposition. When someone is convinced of something, it’s impossible to rationalize anything to them. That goes for both sides!

In my opinion, it would be much better if everyone leaned more centrist. Find common ground and peaceful debate the differences.

I think they will come down on Jon extra hard because he is a famous musician.. They want to make a few examples and even though I don't think he was part of any conspiracy or preplanned attack I think he will be sacrificed.. I don't think he went there to specifically be apart of any insurrection ...he just got caught up in the emotion and scene..

brokentulsa wrote:

I think they will come down on Jon extra hard because he is a famous musician.. They want to make a few examples and even though I don't think he was part of any conspiracy or preplanned attack I think he will be sacrificed.. I don't think he went there to specifically be apart of any insurrection ...he just got caught up in the emotion and scene..

I agree. He got caught up in the hysteria.

In the interview he did before the riot, he said they weren’t looking for trouble... but if anything happens, they are ready. That means he didn’t know what was gonna happen. Unfortunately, he followed them inside.

Well he did use bear spray on the police, and bear spray is suspected to have caused the death of officer Sicknick.

https://www.smh.com.au/world/north-america/bear-spray-suspected-as-cause-of-officer-s-riot-death-in-capitol-riots-20210228-p576ge.html

https://www.blabbermouth.net/news/iced-earths-jon-schaffer-arrested-for-role-in-capitol-riot/

https://loudwire.com/iced-earth-jon-schaffer-six-federal-charges-capitol-riot-bear-spray/

https://www.indystar.com/story/news/2021/01/18/fbi-says-hoosier-musician-used-pepper-spray-police-capitol-riot/4202526001/

Troublezone wrote:

brokentulsa wrote:

I think they will come down on Jon extra hard because he is a famous musician.. They want to make a few examples and even though I don't think he was part of any conspiracy or preplanned attack I think he will be sacrificed.. I don't think he went there to specifically be apart of any insurrection ...he just got caught up in the emotion and scene..

I agree. He got caught up in the hysteria.

In the interview he did before the riot, he said they weren’t looking for trouble... but if anything happens, they are ready. That means he didn’t know what was gonna happen. Unfortunately, he followed them inside.

That interview is not from the riot. That's from November.

Lari wrote:

Troublezone wrote:

brokentulsa wrote:

I think they will come down on Jon extra hard because he is a famous musician.. They want to make a few examples and even though I don't think he was part of any conspiracy or preplanned attack I think he will be sacrificed.. I don't think he went there to specifically be apart of any insurrection ...he just got caught up in the emotion and scene..

I agree. He got caught up in the hysteria.

In the interview he did before the riot, he said they weren’t looking for trouble... but if anything happens, they are ready. That means he didn’t know what was gonna happen. Unfortunately, he followed them inside.

That interview is not from the riot. That's from November.

Regardless of the exact time it was filmed, he still said he wasn’t looking for violence, but would be ready if it happens. I don’t think he knew beforehand that he would be able to go inside the capital so easily with a mob. It just happened. Even the mob didn’t know that the capital was going to be so weakly protected.

Troublezone wrote:

In my opinion, it would be much better if everyone leaned more centrist. Find common ground and peaceful debate the differences.

You could, you know, give it a shot yourself.

brokentulsa wrote:

I think they will come down on Jon extra hard because he is a famous musician.. They want to make a few examples and even though I don't think he was part of any conspiracy or preplanned attack I think he will be sacrificed.. I don't think he went there to specifically be apart of any insurrection ...he just got caught up in the emotion and scene..

He absolutely went there fully intending on doing what he did. Come on.

brokentulsa wrote:

I think they will come down on Jon extra hard because he is a famous musician

Outside of the hard core metal nerd crowd, is Jon Schaffer really that "famous"?

Mention Iced Earth or Jon to a random person on the street and most likely the response would be "who the hell is that?"

Eyesore wrote:

Troublezone wrote:

In my opinion, it would be much better if everyone leaned more centrist. Find common ground and peaceful debate the differences.

You could, you know, give it a shot yourself.

I consider myself center-right. I will call out people on both sides. I criticized Ted Cruz for his actions.

Eyesore wrote:

brokentulsa wrote:

I think they will come down on Jon extra hard because he is a famous musician.. They want to make a few examples and even though I don't think he was part of any conspiracy or preplanned attack I think he will be sacrificed.. I don't think he went there to specifically be apart of any insurrection ...he just got caught up in the emotion and scene..

He absolutely went there fully intending on doing what he did. Come on.

How do you know for sure? Only Jon knows the answer to that.

Quote :

I consider myself center-right. I will call out people on both sides. I criticized Ted Cruz for his actions.

I giva ya credit TZ .. you have called out some republicans.. Im sure even Trump did a few things you were not happy with.. I think Biden is wrong to stop the wall and open the border.. and the green new deal is questionable to me and I agree with libertarians that there should be no gun laws..

Quote :

Outside of the hard core metal nerd crowd, is Jon Schaffer really that "famous"?

He probably wasn’t but since this happened even main stream media has been reporting on him and Iced earth.. you could say mainstreem media is the best Promotion Iced Earth ever got I have seen storys about him on huffpost, cnn, bbc and aljazeera.. They do still have millions of people that check those sites out..

brokentulsa wrote:

Quote :

I consider myself center-right. I will call out people on both sides. I criticized Ted Cruz for his actions.

I giva ya credit TZ .. you have called out some republicans.. Im sure even Trump did a few things you were not happy with.. I think Biden is wrong to stop the wall and open the border.. and the green new deal is questionable to me and I agree with libertarians that there should be no gun laws..

I don’t completely trust any politicians. That’s part of the reason I liked Trump better. He isn’t a politician. And I liked his effort to secure the borders, boost the economy, force NATO and our allies to start pulling their own weight and confront China about trade deals.

I think some people thought I was a hardcore right-winger because I defended Trump, but I feel much closer to center-right. And yes, Trump isn’t perfect... he has flaws like any other person.

Troublezone wrote:

brokentulsa wrote:

Quote :

I consider myself center-right. I will call out people on both sides. I criticized Ted Cruz for his actions.

I giva ya credit TZ .. you have called out some republicans.. Im sure even Trump did a few things you were not happy with.. I think Biden is wrong to stop the wall and open the border.. and the green new deal is questionable to me and I agree with libertarians that there should be no gun laws..

I don’t completely trust any politicians. That’s part of the reason I liked Trump better. He isn’t a politician. And I liked his effort to secure the borders, boost the economy, force NATO and our allies to start pulling their own weight and confront China about trade deals.

I think some people thought I was a hardcore right-winger because I defended Trump, but I feel much closer to center-right. And yes, Trump isn’t perfect... he has flaws like any other person.

Trump isn't a "politician" by name, but he's cut from the same cloth as the worst of them. He has, is, and always will be a corrupt human being. What good he may have done in office (and every president does good) will never change that.

Lari wrote:

Well he did use bear spray on the police, and bear spray is suspected to have caused the death of officer Sicknick.

https://www.smh.com.au/world/north-america/bear-spray-suspected-as-cause-of-officer-s-riot-death-in-capitol-riots-20210228-p576ge.html

https://www.blabbermouth.net/news/iced-earths-jon-schaffer-arrested-for-role-in-capitol-riot/

https://loudwire.com/iced-earth-jon-schaffer-six-federal-charges-capitol-riot-bear-spray/

https://www.indystar.com/story/news/2021/01/18/fbi-says-hoosier-musician-used-pepper-spray-police-capitol-riot/4202526001/

Yeah those photos prove everything. If he's guilty, then so be it, but when did it start to be okay in this country to be guilty before proven innocent? The whole thing is smoke and mirrors, and complete bullshit.

Eyesore wrote:

Troublezone wrote:

brokentulsa wrote:

Quote :

I consider myself center-right. I will call out people on both sides. I criticized Ted Cruz for his actions.

I giva ya credit TZ .. you have called out some republicans.. Im sure even Trump did a few things you were not happy with.. I think Biden is wrong to stop the wall and open the border.. and the green new deal is questionable to me and I agree with libertarians that there should be no gun laws..

I don’t completely trust any politicians. That’s part of the reason I liked Trump better. He isn’t a politician. And I liked his effort to secure the borders, boost the economy, force NATO and our allies to start pulling their own weight and confront China about trade deals.

I think some people thought I was a hardcore right-winger because I defended Trump, but I feel much closer to center-right. And yes, Trump isn’t perfect... he has flaws like any other person.

Trump isn't a "politician" by name, but he's cut from the same cloth as the worst of them. He has, is, and always will be a corrupt human being. What good he may have done in office (and every president does good) will never change that.

I’m sure there are murderers and wife abusers (name the sin) out there that hate Trump. But somehow he is the most corrupt person because of his personality or his policies. While it may be satisfying for some to bash him, I think it’s crazy that people think any other politicians or whatever are not corrupt humans.

Name me one person in politics that you think is better than Trump, and there is a 50% chance that person has a shocking secret life. Probably much worse than the issues people hate about Trump.

Wrecked Neck wrote:

Lari wrote:

Well he did use bear spray on the police, and bear spray is suspected to have caused the death of officer Sicknick.

https://www.smh.com.au/world/north-america/bear-spray-suspected-as-cause-of-officer-s-riot-death-in-capitol-riots-20210228-p576ge.html

https://www.blabbermouth.net/news/iced-earths-jon-schaffer-arrested-for-role-in-capitol-riot/

https://loudwire.com/iced-earth-jon-schaffer-six-federal-charges-capitol-riot-bear-spray/

https://www.indystar.com/story/news/2021/01/18/fbi-says-hoosier-musician-used-pepper-spray-police-capitol-riot/4202526001/

Yeah those photos prove everything. If he's guilty, then so be it, but when did it start to be okay in this country to be guilty before proven innocent? The whole thing is smoke and mirrors, and complete bullshit.

And the irony is that a lot of people that are condemning Jon have some really evil sins in their own closets. I would rather be a guy known for trespassing than (who knows what) crimes some of his haters have done. It’s human nature to be a hypocrite. Let the man go to trial.

It’s actually infuriating that some people in Washington are secretly involved in some major crimes that would probably shock the world and all these people want to do is talk about a guy that basically trespassed and shouted at people within a mob. The bear spray (manslaughter) thing is far fetched. The shit is literally formulated to affect bears. Humans are biological different. Regular pepper spray is more likely to hurt a person. Did he even discharge the spray? I’m sure many others had some spray devices.

I feel very sad for Jon. He truly doesn't deserve any of this.

As TZ stated, there are people in very high positions who have done much worse, and are still ruling our destiny.