Unorthodox Metal Opinions?

Hadley wrote:

Warrant's cover of "We Will Rock You" is better than the original

Disturbed are a lot more "metal" than some of the "true metal" bands out there

I actually like Disturbed but I find them a little too "samey" for me.

Boris2008 wrote:

Guys dressing as women is a fetish, not a genre of metal.

that may be true but.........

image isn't basis for a music style, The music is, plain and simple.

I understand the dislkike of image but you cannot deny the music doesn't always match the image. Look at Icon on the self titled debut. They look like Poison but sound like any traditional metal band of the day (1983 or so)

I can go on and on,,,,,Leatherwolf, Stryper, WASP, Lizzy Borden (early Crue), hell even Slayer wore make up and spamdex when they first popped up. (Iwas there and it was for almost ayear)

James B. wrote:

Boris2008 wrote:

Guys dressing as women is a fetish, not a genre of metal.

that may be true but.........

image isn't basis for a music style, The music is, plain and simple.

I understand the dislkike of image but you cannot deny the music doesn't always match the image. Look at Icon on the self titled debut. They look like Poison but sound like any traditional metal band of the day (1983 or so)

I can go on and on,,,,,Leatherwolf, Stryper, WASP, Lizzy Borden (early Crue), hell even Slayer wore make up and spamdex when they first popped up. (Iwas there and it was for almost ayear)

I agree with you. I love The New York Dolls and quite like the first two Motley records, early WASP and the RATT debut Mini LP. My main problem was when these guys signed to majors, the image and the music that was once controversial and edgy was reduced to over produced music that didn't resemble any kind of metal that I wanted to listen to and an image directly aimed at teenage girls, it all got a bit too pretty, too safe. (not WASP though, they were waaaayy too ugly!! )

I understand why it happened but it held no appeal for me and I have a hard time relating to it as metal.

correct. W.A.S.P. is/was more metal than ManowaR.


It's too bad "rock stars" in America now only want to dress in random plaid and chains type of stuff... when I was in L.A. I was actually having a difficult time finding a store suited to my needs.....I don't have a lip piercing, or a Nikki Sixx combover...

Hadley wrote:

Metal Archives is a great resource, but they ARE very biased. I can see not including the likes of Kiss or AC/DC or even Van Halen, but there is no reason that Black N Blue, Europe (the first two albums make On Through The Night sound like Hysteria by comparison), or Alice Cooper dont belong on that site (especially when they DO include much lighter stuff like Krokus or Quiet Riot).

I know that Europe was on there at one point, but got deleted later on.

I do find Metal Archives to be biased at times. They refused to give Soulfly an entry for quite some time, and from what I read somewhere, it had to do with the fact that Fred Durst was on one song on their first album. They did cave in eventually and finally (albeit grudgingly) added Soulfly to the site.

I like Slang by Def Leppard. It is the only post-Pyromania album I listen to(if you don't count Retroactive, which is a comp anyway).

Taking Over is the best thrash album of all thrash albums, bar none.

Now then, my two-cents on post/core/emo/screamo/genremadness. I listened to this stuff a lot for a few years and even got into what I call the "skinny pants" metal like Underoath, Devil Wears Prada, Emery, Finch, and so forth. One thing I noticed with these bands is they had a tendency to return to two elements ad nauseum: double bass and minor I-VI movements. Eventually things got weird and it seemed like they were pulling chords out of their ass without any concern for proper construction, like some kind of atonal avant-garde kick, but it seemed forced. I think what hooked me--and the same was for core music--was the screaming; it felt so aggressive as opposed to threatening like Death or Morbid Angel. But I gradually began to see the shallowness of it all and the copycat tendencies. Now I really can't stand it, as a lot of originality is thrown out the window. Also got tired of the whiny I Hate lyrics. At least when Overkill did it, you knew it was tongue in cheek. There, I'm done.

EVERY Accept album is a masterpiece, although I wish they'd go back and remix Death Row. I believe that's unorthodox.

Orion Crystal Ice wrote:

correct. W.A.S.P. is/was more metal than ManowaR.

lolwut

I guess my main "Unorthodox Metal Opinion" would be that Nu-Metal & Metalcore are both metal.

Hadley wrote:

Metal Archives is a great resource, but they ARE very biased. I can see not including the likes of Kiss or AC/DC or even Van Halen, but there is no reason that Black N Blue, Europe (the first two albums make On Through The Night sound like Hysteria by comparison), or Alice Cooper dont belong on that site (especially when they DO include much lighter stuff like Krokus or Quiet Riot).

I dunno if i'd call them elitist, I can see why Alice Cooper isn't on there(he was never really what you'd call "metal"), the other two you might be able to get on there if you make a strong enough case.

I actually wrote a review on there for Sonic Syndicate-We Rule The Night:
http://www.metal-archives.com/reviews/Sonic_Syndicate/We_Rule_the_Night/268251/darkrage6

Awake is a better Dream Theater album than Images And Words (though not by much)

James B. wrote:

Boris2008 wrote:

Guys dressing as women is a fetish, not a genre of metal.

:lol!:

that may be true but.........

image isn't basis for a music style, The music is, plain and simple.

I understand the dislkike of image but you cannot deny the music doesn't always match the image. Look at Icon on the self titled debut. They look like Poison but sound like any traditional metal band of the day (1983 or so)

I can go on and on,,,,,Leatherwolf, Stryper, WASP, Lizzy Borden (early Crue), hell even Slayer wore make up and spamdex when they first popped up. (Iwas there and it was for almost ayear)

On the note about Poison - everyone rags on them like they are the coming of the anti-christ. I must confess I thought the same of them once but more recently I started getting into their music and they are such a damn fun band! I looked up their history a bit and to me it seems like they were one of the hardest working glam bands around at the time. They weren't LA natives, they paid their dues playing clubs, they did a lot of the leg work themselves in the early days - they were a very DYI type band.

Eventually the made it bigger but that doesn't necessarily mean it was without merit. Listening to the first 3 albums I can definitely tell a progression from a more Motley Crue influenced sound to a bluesier hard rockin sound.

I may be in the minority here, and given this is also an unorthodox opinions thread but Poison rock!

Alex Dee Rokket wrote:

James B. wrote:

Boris2008 wrote:

Guys dressing as women is a fetish, not a genre of metal.

that may be true but.........

image isn't basis for a music style, The music is, plain and simple.

I understand the dislkike of image but you cannot deny the music doesn't always match the image. Look at Icon on the self titled debut. They look like Poison but sound like any traditional metal band of the day (1983 or so)

I can go on and on,,,,,Leatherwolf, Stryper, WASP, Lizzy Borden (early Crue), hell even Slayer wore make up and spamdex when they first popped up. (Iwas there and it was for almost ayear)

On the note about Poison - everyone rags on them like they are the coming of the anti-christ. I must confess I thought the same of them once but more recently I started getting into their music and they are such a damn fun band! I looked up their history a bit and to me it seems like they were one of the hardest working glam bands around at the time. They weren't LA natives, they paid their dues playing clubs, they did a lot of the leg work themselves in the early days - they were a very DYI type band.

Eventually the made it bigger but that doesn't necessarily mean it was without merit. Listening to the first 3 albums I can definitely tell a progression from a more Motley Crue influenced sound to a bluesier hard rockin sound.

I may be in the minority here, and given this is also an unorthodox opinions thread but Poison rock!

I enjoy Poison quite a bit myself.

I started out with their Greatest Hits a couple of years ago, and I now have their first 3 albums. All three have something cool to offer. Open Up is my favorite. Flesh & Blood is very bluesy sounding with late 80s glam / hard rock thrown in the mix.

I want to check out their newer albums some time, I don't remember much of Hollyweird but I heard it about a decade ago when it was released.

I hate to admit it but I like those sissy burgers, Poison. Its just fun, dumb glam metal. I don't listen to them often but I do like them.

And damn it Alice Cooper was a metal pioneer and he was considered metal since the term first became popular, sure he has branched off and down other things, but he has always been considered a metal artist.

When Look What The Cat Dragged In came out I became a fan. Then almost instantly there came the backlash which I went along with. A couple of years later my girlfriend's mom got her tickets for Poison with the idea being she only trusted me to take her. At that time I was in a hardcore rap/punk/thrash/anything P.O'd phase. Needless to say Poison was last on my list of bands I wanted to see. To this day it is one of my favorite shows I ever saw. It was fun, well played, high energy, and just about everything a concert should be. Never looked back on my fandom after that.

Crack A Smile is one of those albums where I had low expectations but then got shocked by how good it was.


Along with the Poison fandom, I'm also a big Vixen fan. They too put on one of my favorite concerts.

I don't care about Poison, but you definitely can't go wrong with a laser show.

jstate wrote:

When Look What The Cat Dragged In came out I became a fan. Then almost instantly there came the backlash which I went along with. A couple of years later my girlfriend's mom got her tickets for Poison with the idea being she only trusted me to take her. At that time I was in a hardcore rap/punk/thrash/anything P.O'd phase. Needless to say Poison was last on my list of bands I wanted to see. To this day it is one of my favorite shows I ever saw. It was fun, well played, high energy, and just about everything a concert should be. Never looked back on my fandom after that.

Crack A Smile is one of those albums where I had low expectations but then got shocked by how good it was.


Along with the Poison fandom, I'm also a big Vixen fan. They too put on one of my favorite concerts.

My girlfriend at the time, bought Poison tickets for 'Open and Say AHHH!' tour, and like you, while I liked them, I had no interest whatsoever and seeing them.

Once I got there, not only was the show great but all the hot future soccer moms of America filled the hall, I had never seen so many hot Bettys (to use James B's term) in one place.

No kidding. I remember the line for the girls' bathroom was endless. In the boys' one there was like two other dudes and we all laughed about how we got dragged to Poison by chicks and were then loving it. This being the Capital Center - they actually stationed one of their big Yellow jacket security guards at the front of the boys room to make sure no girls would even think about jumping in there. The security priorities of that place (RIP) never ceased to amaze me.

In the heat of loving the show I actually bought a shirt too. Damn did I catch hell from everyone for wearing that. At the time my t-shirt regular rotation was Poison, Anthrax, Public Enemy, and Bad Brains.


Don't know that it is unorthodox or not, but I always felt bands like Death Angel, Warrior Soul, and Voivod could've/should've mixed in nicely with the 90's alternative era. They would have not have been out of place on a Lollapalooza line-up IMO.

Alex Dee Rokket wrote:

I don't really care for Metal Archives' elitist opinions - good resource for encyclopedic purposes only but no more.

As for KISS, AC/DC, Van Halen, and then bands like Dokken and RATT. Let Metal Archives sit on their high horse because imo all those bands are metal. At their respective times in history, all those bands were doing something unique and were considered heavy

So...What is hard rock then? The line has to be drawn somewhere...

TheGreatDuck wrote:

So...What is hard rock then? The line has to be drawn somewhere...

Where is that written in the rule book? I can't seem to find my copy anywhere....

It's probably in the liner notes of a manowar album somewhere.

TheGreatDuck wrote:

Alex Dee Rokket wrote:

I don't really care for Metal Archives' elitist opinions - good resource for encyclopedic purposes only but no more.

As for KISS, AC/DC, Van Halen, and then bands like Dokken and RATT. Let Metal Archives sit on their high horse because imo all those bands are metal. At their respective times in history, all those bands were doing something unique and were considered heavy

So...What is hard rock then? The line has to be drawn somewhere...

It used to be synonyous. Heavy metal was hard rock, hard rock was heavy metal. For me, personally, it's still that way!

To me, Van Halen is the epitome of Hard Rock. Roth-era, that is. Maybe F*ck with Hagar too. But not. Fifty. One. f*cking. Fifty.

As for Poison, I never considered them Metal at all. They have a weird, dull mix that isn't very metallic, especially on Open Up and Say Ahhhh, Brett has a mediocre voice and C.C. is a boring guitarist. It was always weird music to me that was more fitting for Pop Rock radio.

I love Ratt, but I'm not so sure I would call them "metal", or KISS for that matter.