What is so great about Vengence Rising?

Its refreshing to be on a board, talk about VR and Roger and not see someone throw up the obligitory picture of the opened can of worms.

Welcome Sons-of-vengeance!

I first saw that vid about a year ago...its awesome! "if it jams it jams"!!!

In 1987 when I first Vengeance at the Set Free Christian Fellowship in So Cal the night before the first Metal Midnight (we drove 400 miles to the Metal Midnight ) Vengeance just blew OUR FREAKIN! MINDS!!!!... The next day I was trying to tell the guys in 'Soldier' about this band, We then saw 'Deliverance' with Larry Farkas filling in.... phew.....



They were heavy yes and fast yes but had UNBELIEVABLE stage presence!!! I wasn't seeing Metallica or Slayer or Megadeth move onstage like these guys did.... WINDMILLS indeed....!!... they owned the stage !!

And they could play!!

When they released their five song demo at 'Metal Mardi Gras' it was shredding.... !!

It's real easy to sit back 20 years later and say 'Human Sacrifice' sucks or is 'average....'......

When 'Human Sacrifice' was released in 1988 it received a 4 KKKK review in Kerrang!.... It was and still is a GREAT thrash album.... The vocals were frankly part of the 'charm' or appeal as it were at the time.... The riffs were plenty heavy and didn't sound like everyone else... imo...

Yes I guess you had to be there, but when there 500x's as many bands now as there were then I guess we can get a bit 'snooty'... but if 'Vengeance' didn't sell you can bet your bottom dollar the Christian Labels wouldn't have signed ANYONE else... No Tourniquet, Deliverance, Sacrament, Believer, ect....

Vengeance was as extreme as the Christian market could handle. They pushed the envelope with their cover and sound.... There were some other releases out there (The Lead come to mind) but not signed to a Major Christian Label....

This sounds vaguely like when I read from people who "weren't there" that 'Star Wars' isn't so great.....

I only like Once Dead and Released Upon the Earth.

troublezone wrote:

I only like Once Dead and Released Upon the Earth.

Good man.

Quote :

In 1987 when I first Vengeance at the Set Free Christian Fellowship in So Cal the night before the first Metal Midnight

Your bringing back the memories. Here's my concert shirt from Metal Midnight III. Featuring Vengeance before the Rising. The back is signed by then Final Axe guitarist Bill Menchen. Good times.

Quote :

The back is signed by then Final Axe guitarist Bill Menchen.

He still is in Final Axe.

I was at that show where this shirt was bought. That was a good show! Vengeance were killer at that show!!

Vengeance, alongside Believer, is one of the few bands my non-Christian metalhead friends loved. My friend bought Human Sacrifice on vinyl even before me! haha (I had it on tape).

Sons-Of-Vengeance wrote:

Quote :

In 1987 when I first Vengeance at the Set Free Christian Fellowship in So Cal the night before the first Metal Midnight

Your bringing back the memories. Here's my concert shirt from Metal Midnight III. Featuring Vengeance before the Rising. The back is signed by then Final Axe guitarist Bill Menchen. Good times.

It was at that show that Bride stopped being HEAVY Metal and went in their Guns N Roses direction... Remember 'Silence is Madness' had been released about a month before. They played all these crap tunes that NO ONE knew and gave us a 3 song melody from 'SIM' and ended the gig...... BOOOOO!!!

Vengeance introduced 'Into The Abyss' at that show and BLEW EVERYONE AWAY and Took NO PRISONERS. At the time 'Abyss' sounded like the heaviest thing in the world.... WOW!!!

Yes those were some GREAT TIMES !!!!

[quote="mr.electric39"}
Vengeance introduced 'Into The Abyss' at that show and BLEW EVERYONE AWAY and Took NO PRISONERS. At the time 'Abyss' sounded like the heaviest thing in the world.... WOW!!![/quote]

That was always my favorite song to perform with the band. It was surreal being up on stage with Larry Farkas grabbing the violin bow for the opening moments of that song. Still one of my favorite Vengeance Rising songs.

ultmetal wrote:

[quote="mr.electric39"}
Vengeance introduced 'Into The Abyss' at that show and BLEW EVERYONE AWAY and Took NO PRISONERS. At the time 'Abyss' sounded like the heaviest thing in the world.... WOW!!!

That was always my favorite song to perform with the band. It was surreal being up on stage with Larry Farkas grabbing the violin bow for the opening moments of that song. Still one of my favorite Vengeance Rising songs.[/quote]


Ult, That musta been quite a feeling!! Dude when they played that song at the MM my buddy Dave and I looked at each other and about fainted.... It just sounded so BRUTAL! Brillaint riffage and POWER....!

They were at their prime and dusted everyone....

Ironically I pulled out "once dead' about 8 weeks ago and revisted 'Abyss', 'Warfare'-Roger Martins bass tone was amazing, 'Can't Get Out'... it's still just as heavy, but now the scene has 'passed' them as it were.... They're not the extreme they once were...

Help Me on Released has to be one of the best intro's ever.....................IMO.

ramreb wrote:

Help Me on Released has to be one of the best intro's ever.....................IMO.

Its definately creepy thats for sure...

Stender wrote:

ramreb wrote:

Help Me on Released has to be one of the best intro's ever.....................IMO.

Its definately creepy thats for sure...

Pretty damn awesome for sure.

so now we know what's so great about vengeance:

1. awesome riffs
2. different lyrical ideas
3. brutal, pummeling music
4. and plenty of nostalgia for all you old farts

sounds like a winner to me

/thread

Quote :

Vengeance introduced 'Into The Abyss' at that show and BLEW EVERYONE AWAY and Took NO PRISONERS. At the time 'Abyss' sounded like the heaviest thing in the world.... WOW!!!

Quote :

Ult, That musta been quite a feeling!! Dude when they played that song at the MM my buddy Dave and I looked at each other and about fainted.... It just sounded so BRUTAL! Brillaint riffage and POWER....!

From my perspective back in the mid eighties most of the kids that were into christian metal were church kids. I know a lot of the bands were a vehicle to minister to kids that were not a part of the faith. But most of the fans were already established church kids wanting a little more heavy than Petra and Whiteheart. Most of us came from strict christian homes where secular metal was a no-no and we had no access to it. So naturally when Vengeance came about we were all blown away by the sheer heaviness and raw energy of it all. It's evendent in some of the fanzine reviews back in the day when we all thought Stryper and Saint and Barren Cross were HEAVY. We had no clue what was truely heavy until VR brought out their brand of thrash metal. As far as Scott fronting the band years later after being so influenced by them, man that must have been very surreal to say the least.

Quote :

4. and plenty of nostalgia for all you old farts

Vengence IMO, is the worst christian band in the history of christian metal. I bought Human Sacrifice in the late 80's because of the hype and I gave it away as soon as I could find a taker. Roger Martinez is one of the worst singers, growlers, barkers of all-time.IMO

[quote]Vengence IMO, is the worst christian band in the history of christian metal. I bought Human Sacrifice in the late 80's because of the hype and I gave it away as soon as I could find a taker. Roger Martinez is one of the worst singers, growlers, barkers of all-time.IMO

Heathen............you need your ears dewaxed!,

Seriously, I don't know whether it's nostalgia or not but they still great to my ears!

Destruction Comes was my favorite for a long time even though I had the first 2, then Released came out and that took over.

I listened to Once Dead (VR) the other day, 1st time in eons and man did that sound Killer.

Sons-Of-Vengeance wrote:

Quote :

Vengeance introduced 'Into The Abyss' at that show and BLEW EVERYONE AWAY and Took NO PRISONERS. At the time 'Abyss' sounded like the heaviest thing in the world.... WOW!!!

Quote :

Ult, That musta been quite a feeling!! Dude when they played that song at the MM my buddy Dave and I looked at each other and about fainted.... It just sounded so BRUTAL! Brillaint riffage and POWER....!

From my perspective back in the mid eighties most of the kids that were into christian metal were church kids. I know a lot of the bands were a vehicle to minister to kids that were not a part of the faith. But most of the fans were already established church kids wanting a little more heavy than Petra and Whiteheart. Most of us came from strict christian homes where secular metal was a no-no and we had no access to it. So naturally when Vengeance came about we were all blown away by the sheer heaviness and raw energy of it all. It's evendent in some of the fanzine reviews back in the day when we all thought Stryper and Saint and Barren Cross were HEAVY. We had no clue what was truely heavy until VR brought out their brand of thrash metal. As far as Scott fronting the band years later after being so influenced by them, man that must have been very surreal to say the least.

Quote :

4. and plenty of nostalgia for all you old farts

I was 20-21 years old when Human Sacrifice came out... I was a big fan of Metallica, Megadeth, Testament, Anthrax at the time.

If Vengeance had been awful live no amount of 'hype' would've saved 'em for me. Same thing for Deliverance, Believer, The Crucified... I refused to listen to guys who tanked in a concert setting... i.e. Messiah Prophet...

Vengeance were the really deal.

Vengeance pretty much ruled the Christian thrash scene for the span of their first two albums. Sure, there was Deliverance and Believer (and Sacrament a little later), but Vengeance was the most extreme. I love 'em.

Been listening to Destruction Comes today.

I underrated this thing! It's been quite a while since I've given this one a good listen, but this is not bad at all. VR didn't make a bad album!

scottmitchell74 wrote:

Been listening to Destruction Comes today.

I underrated this thing! It's been quite a while since I've given this one a good listen, but this is not bad at all. VR didn't make a bad album!

Destruction Comes is a ripping thrash bash and I can totally agree with you on VR never making a bad album. I've even come to point in the past where I thought Destruction Comes was better than Once Dead and Human Sacrifice.

mr.electric39 wrote:

Sons-Of-Vengeance wrote:

Quote :

In 1987 when I first Vengeance at the Set Free Christian Fellowship in So Cal the night before the first Metal Midnight

Your bringing back the memories. Here's my concert shirt from Metal Midnight III. Featuring Vengeance before the Rising. The back is signed by then Final Axe guitarist Bill Menchen. Good times.

It was at that show that Bride stopped being HEAVY Metal and went in their Guns N Roses direction... Remember 'Silence is Madness' had been released about a month before. They played all these crap tunes that NO ONE knew and gave us a 3 song melody from 'SIM' and ended the gig...... BOOOOO!!!

Vengeance introduced 'Into The Abyss' at that show and BLEW EVERYONE AWAY and Took NO PRISONERS. At the time 'Abyss' sounded like the heaviest thing in the world.... WOW!!!

Yes those were some GREAT TIMES !!!!

I first saw X-Sinner at Set Free in Orange County long before the guy in Zion came around. Vengeance was a nice contrast to all the other bands in the Sanctuary scene. I saw them dozens of times before they split from Roger and became Die Happy. Kieth put on some killer gigs with the Metal Midnite shows and His Festivals.
The entire scene was great to witness and be a part of. You guys who may of been around So. Calif, during this time may have memories of The Oasis in Hollwood.
Those who have qualms with Christian Metal as a valid term wasn't there to witness what was happening in the buildings of churches throughout Southern California from 85' to 92'. It was a seperate thing than what was happening on The Strip, though alot of bands with Christians played those same stages, myself included. Some of these bands were just that, bands. While other were music ministry and had a different accountability. Alot of lives were changed back then. For the good and sadly enough for the bad. Regardless of VR's ability to play in a manner that suits an individuals taste or how they rate in one's opinion of kick @$$ or just plain sucks isn't merely as important as how they were used as a tool to Glorify Jesus and bring alot of folks to accept Christ as Savior by the style of music they jammed onstage.

anyon here actualy hear roger talk? he just rambles on and on and on.......and on

metalhead777 wrote:

anyon here actualy hear roger talk? he just rambles on and on and on.......and on

Thats something that can happen when you have a mental illness.