Guns n Roses Chinese Democracy

Quite an interesting article, actually. In the last few days, I have basically been binging on GN'R, which I haven't done in a good few years. Whilst I know a lot here will claim them overrated, I believe that they were, at their peak, literally one of the greatest rock bands of all time. But hey, that's quite a subjective view point.

What I find interesting though is the band's history. I watched the Behind The Music episode of theirs today and the one thing that is clear is Axl seriously has mental problems. Not even in a jokey way. Of course, he's notorious for being a quite literally 'off-the-hook' frontman, and to this day that hasn't really changed, but the way he acts in interviews, the way he conducts himself is all very... odd. The fact he basically became a recluse for so long does little to change this. And yet, I also think he is an absolutely brilliant songwriter. I don't know, I just find something about his very odd, vision driven mentality very interesting. Not entirely sure what my point was, just sharing a few thoughts there.

I agree about the mental problems but what i didnt like about the gnr behind the music was it was just slash, that was it. Nothing against Slash but i was hoping to see Duff and maybe even Izzy and Steve

Here's my one word review of this 25 million dollar, 13 years in the making album.....


Poop.

Selvmord wrote:

Here's my one word review of this 25 million dollar, 13 years in the making album.....


Poop.

Mega-poop

Those Illusion albums were so lame and full of filler, Im expecting more or less the same here.

Addy wrote:

I agree about the mental problems but what i didnt like about the gnr behind the music was it was just slash, that was it. Nothing against Slash but i was hoping to see Duff and maybe even Izzy and Steve

Steve was in there. A lot. That stroke has clearly left him in quite a bad way. I'm also almost sure Duff was in there at some point, but the lack of Izzy was definitely a disappointment.

Also DeathCult, on the Illusion albums, what do you define as filler? On the two albums there's only one song I actively dislike, 'You Ain't the First'. The rest I think range from good to excellent. I'm not saying you're wrong, because of course you're not - indeed, plenty share your opinion - I am just curious.

i only have illusion two and i think it is an excellent album with some brilliant songs. sure it is far removed from afd but then thats expected

Quote :

Steve was in there. A lot. That stroke has clearly left him in quite a bad way. I'm also almost sure Duff was in there at some point, but the lack of Izzy was definitely a disappointment.

Steven Adler is on the new season of Celebrity Rehab and although I have not seen it myself, from what I understand, he's a real mess. Growing up, he was best friends with Slash and now he feels abandoned. Can't say I blame Slash though for distancing himself from that train wreck. It's a shame really.

MetalGuy71 wrote:

Quote :

Steve was in there. A lot. That stroke has clearly left him in quite a bad way. I'm also almost sure Duff was in there at some point, but the lack of Izzy was definitely a disappointment.

Steven Adler is on the new season of Celebrity Rehab and although I have not seen it myself, from what I understand, he's a real mess. Growing up, he was best friends with Slash and now he feels abandoned. Can't say I blame Slash though for distancing himself from that train wreck. It's a shame really.

He's a real mess, only in the sense that he's an addict like everyone else. Supposedly the longest duration he's been sober since 11 YEARS OLD had been 4 DAYS!!! Both of those numbers are absolutely staggering. His sad story basically goes all the way back to when he was 11. Steven's Step-father gave his Mother an ultimatum when Steven was 11, that it was either him or her son. She didn't choose Steven, so when he got home from school one day; Steven found all of his belongings set outside the house. Can anyone imagine having to deal with those type of emotions as an 11 year old? Absolutely sickening!

Steven seems to be the one of those who is progressing nicely in rehab. He's open, he knows that his life has been a mess because of his addictions, he wants to get better, and more than anything he wants to play music with his best friend Slash.

the sentinel wrote:

DeathCult wrote:

xyz wrote:

Addy wrote:

Really? that many? Daaaannnnng

Well, he's had 14 years of free time. He's had to have recorded quite a few songs in that time.

Or done an assload of drugs in the interim

I vote for assload of drug usage!!!


For Axl, not me.

Me neither. Sorry, I didn't mean to make it look as though it would be you doing the drugs.

Yeah, Slash and Steven were very tight and i cannot even begin to phathom dealing with being kicked out at 11 years old. I have an 11 year old stepson Its sickening to say the least.

Maybe i need to be a bit more clear, on the GNR BTM there was some Steve footage, but even most of the stuff from Duff was old clipings along with Axl. Would have been nice if all the original members were interviewed for it. I just think they could have done better with it. Though I do have to say that the Aerosmith BTM absolutely ROCKS!!!!!!!

I have a hard time feeling sorry for Steven Adler. I am sorry he had a rough life, and I have never walked a mile in his shoes. But drug addiction is something that happens to you due to choices you make. His biggest ambition in life should n't be to play with Slash but to get himself together.

His days as a professional musician are over, whatever drumming abilities he had are diminished beyond repair. The reason he was fired from Guns N Roses was because his addiction caused him to not play the drums as well, missed rehearsals, and when the members of Guns N Roses think you have a drug problem and are acting unprofessional that is scary.

I do hope the guy gets it toghether, but Slash owes him nothing, and Adler getting fired from Guns N Roses may have saved his life.

I met Steven Adler in the early 90s, shortly after he had been dismissed from GNR... and trust me, there was NOBODY home in there...

manny wrote:

I have a hard time feeling sorry for Steven Adler. I am sorry he had a rough life, and I have never walked a mile in his shoes. But drug addiction is something that happens to you due to choices you make. His biggest ambition in life should n't be to play with Slash but to get himself together.

His days as a professional musician are over, whatever drumming abilities he had are diminished beyond repair. The reason he was fired from Guns N Roses was because his addiction caused him to not play the drums as well, missed rehearsals, and when the members of Guns N Roses think you have a drug problem and are acting unprofessional that is scary.

I do hope the guy gets it toghether, but Slash owes him nothing, and Adler getting fired from Guns N Roses may have saved his life.

Well, we probably have a difference of opinion when it comes to addiction. I know that Eyesore thinks it's ridiculous that one can become an addict because there is a family history of let's say alcoholism. The medical community has produced substantial evidence that there is a gene linked to alcoholism. I've first hand seen this take place on my Mother's side of the family, where four out of the seven kids would be considered alcoholics (both parents were also alcoholics). Was Steven prediposed to being a hard core drug addict? Probably not, but most addicts problems started with alcohol, and then they take it to the next level.

You have to remember that Steven is only in the very beginning of getting his life on track. It will be a life long battle. The fact that he places such significance on playing the drums again with Slash is not surprising. Playing the drums was his life, so I'm sure he knows nothing else outside of that. I'm willing to bet the guy probably never graduated from high school, so, his options are probably very limited. It would be great to see him (if he kept up with his sobriety/drug free life) to make the rounds, speaking to those who have drug/alcohol issues, go to schools, etc... He probably could make a living from doing just that, and maybe even teaching drums to kids.

Sadly, if he did find his way back into a band, I think being on the road, living the life of a musician would make it to tempting to go back to his old life. I just think we need to be somewhat empathetic to these people. These people that Dr. Drew are dealing with are all really working hard to get on the straight and narrow.

Fat Freddy wrote:

I met Steven Adler in the early 90s, shortly after he had been dismissed from GNR... and trust me, there was NOBODY home in there...

I also ran into him in October of 1996. This was shortly before he had his stroke. He still looked like Steven Adler of the Guns days, but, sadly he was pretty drunk when I saw him. I saw him in a Phoenix bar play 3 songs with a band who played disco music (at a much faster pace/they were actually good). They ended up playing two Guns songs with him, and I don't remember what the other song was. Steven actually did play well that night...

I think Slash has no room, he's not clean even today and from the book he helped write on his life he probobly never will

I will have to admit that I wasn't very sympathic towards drug addiction, and I do not dismiss the fact that some folks more than others maybe predispostion to became alcholics or drug addicts more than others. I know the grip it has on someone and does around them from personal experience.

Aside from that alot of artist that I admire where alcholics and are no longer here, so it is not like I am without sympathy, from my earlier comments I understand why it may seem I am not.

You are right that Steven Adler has a long way to go, and he has just began his journey for a whole new life, but it seems like the man has no support system and I can see what you mean, all he knows is how to play drums.

Its sad and I hope he makes it, but I temper my sympathy with the realism that Adler's addiction where due to not only the choices he made, but how this choices have affected all thoses around him not just himself. Personally I hope he does make it, the world may need another drummer but it certainly doesnot need another rock casuality.

I just heard one of the new songs. Horrible. Just horrible.

metalinmyveins wrote:

Fat Freddy wrote:

I met Steven Adler in the early 90s, shortly after he had been dismissed from GNR... and trust me, there was NOBODY home in there...

I also ran into him in October of 1996. This was shortly before he had his stroke. He still looked like Steven Adler of the Guns days, but, sadly he was pretty drunk when I saw him. I saw him in a Phoenix bar play 3 songs with a band who played disco music (at a much faster pace/they were actually good). They ended up playing two Guns songs with him, and I don't remember what the other song was. Steven actually did play well that night...

Haha, now that you mention it, Steven still managed to wail pretty well on the drums on the night I met him too... he jammed a few tunes with local favorites Bad Biscut and tore it up... I posted the story in another thread a while back, gimme a minute to go find it...

*EDIT: copied & pasted from the "signed stuff" thread"

When I met Steve Adler he'd already been out of GNR for a year or two at least. He was appearing at this dump club on Staten Island, NY (where I went to college) with a short lived band he'd formed with Davy Vain called "Roadcrew," so my friend and I went to check it out.

Anyway, Steven walked into the club while the opening band was on and people started hitting him up for autographs, talking to him, etc so I got in line. I should mention that he already looked pretty wasted. When I got up to him I sez "Hey Steven, how ya doin'?" As he's shaking my hand there was a brief pause while he looked me in the eye (I remember thinking "Dude, there is NOBODY home in there."). Then all of a sudden his face lights up and he's like "AAAAAAAAYYYYYY MAAAAAAAAAAANNN, HOW YA DOIN' BRO?" and shaking my hand so hard I thought he was gonna rip my arm off. I'm like "Um, I'm OK, Steve, how'bout an autograph?" He sez "Sure man, sure, too cool, too cool," signs my cassette insert, pats me on the back and I'm on my way like "Uh, what just happened?" I can only assume he must've mistaken me for somebody he knew, although I didn't have the heart to say anything.

metalinmyveins wrote:

The medical community has produced substantial evidence that there is a gene linked to alcoholism. I've first hand seen this take place on my Mother's side of the family, where four out of the seven kids would be considered alcoholics (both parents were also alcoholics). Was Steven prediposed to being a hard core drug addict? Probably not, but most addicts problems started with alcohol, and then they take it to the next level.

Just for the record, I'm pretty this is still very much up for debate. Whilst there definitely is some genetic link to alcoholism, it's a nature / nurture thing - the nature being that you have a bit of a genetic predisposition to the addiction, but without the right 'nurturing' environment, it'll result in nothing. It's cyclical. The predisposition's actually significance, as far as I'm aware, is still not really known. However, you're definitely right that it can be dehibilitating in a family situtation, but then you can argue that's a nurture thing only - you pick up plenty of bad habits from those closest to you.

On a slightly more topical note, I picked up "The Spaghetti Incident?" the other day, as it was the one album I had missing. I was really pleasantly surprised, as I'd only heard rather lukewarm things about it. But it's a really fun rock album with GN'R sounding a bit more grounded than on the Illusions albums. Songs like 'Down On The Farm', 'Human Being' and 'I Don't Care About You' sound great with GN'R.

DeathCult wrote:

Those Illusion albums were so lame and full of filler, Im expecting more or less the same here.

I heard it and it quite the same, boring!

Wargod48

I dig the Spaghetti Incident Black Leather, Since i dont have you, Down on the Farm, Hair of the Dog

I love the Spaghetti Incident album, where they cover great hard rock/punks bands like The Dead Boys, T.Rex, The UK Subs, Iggy and the Stooges, great stuff.

The only thing is they have song " Black Leather" listed as a Sex Pistols song, but I have n't found any comp or album that it has been on. I do know the Runaways recorded a version of this song that is on " Neon Angels' which I have also seen listed as "and Now the Runaways"

Yeah Ive been looking for the original version of that song too I just looked it up on Wikipedia and it has the song listed by a band called The Professionals

Quote :

The band was formed in 1979 by Steve Jones and Paul Cook, both formerly of the Sex Pistols. As in the Pistols, Jones played guitar, while Cook played drums. Jones supplied lead vocals. Andy Allen, a friend of Jones, joined the band as bass player. He was later ousted and was replaced by bassist Paul Myers (formerly of Subway Sect). Also joining the band was guitarist Ray McVeigh. They signed to Virgin Records in early 1980. Their first release with Virgin was the single "Just Another Dream". They released the album I Didn't See It Coming in November 1981.[1]

The band split up in 1982 after the end of their second US tour. This was prompted in part by a car accident involving all the band apart from Jones and the fact that Jones remained in the US when the rest of the band went back to the UK.

A best-of album was released in 2005 despite the band only ever recording one album, four singles and an album of demos.

Addy wrote:

Yeah Ive been looking for the original version of that song too I just looked it up on Wikipedia and it has the song listed by a band called The Professionals

Quote :

The band was formed in 1979 by Steve Jones and Paul Cook, both formerly of the Sex Pistols. As in the Pistols, Jones played guitar, while Cook played drums. Jones supplied lead vocals. Andy Allen, a friend of Jones, joined the band as bass player. He was later ousted and was replaced by bassist Paul Myers (formerly of Subway Sect). Also joining the band was guitarist Ray McVeigh. They signed to Virgin Records in early 1980. Their first release with Virgin was the single "Just Another Dream". They released the album I Didn't See It Coming in November 1981.[1]

The band split up in 1982 after the end of their second US tour. This was prompted in part by a car accident involving all the band apart from Jones and the fact that Jones remained in the US when the rest of the band went back to the UK.

A best-of album was released in 2005 despite the band only ever recording one album, four singles and an album of demos.

Ok that makes sense now, thanks for the info, the Professionals had Steve Jones and Paul Cook who formed this short lived band after the Sex Pistols broke up. They recorded one album which I have not heard in several years.