Is Metalcore a form of heavy metal?

Of course there are bands and songs that break the general rules. We're talking generalizations here.

One metalcore fan I was just speaking with on Facebook said,

Quote :

80's metal isn't heavy enough and shouldn't even be called heavy metal! It's all about the br00tal breakdowns!!! Breakdowns are metal!!!

That's the sort of stuff that makes me cringe.

ultmetal wrote:

Of course there are bands and songs that break the general rules. We're talking generalizations here.

One metalcore fan I was just speaking with on Facebook said,

Quote :

80's metal isn't heavy enough and shouldn't even be called heavy metal! It's all about the br00tal breakdowns!!! Breakdowns are metal!!!

That's the sort of stuff that makes me cringe.

these are kids, they think HEAVY is the way of life. They dont care about melody, they just want HEAVY!!!!

A lot of people don't seem to grasp that metal in the 70's, 80's, and even 90's, is far different than what it is now. There wasn't nearly as many genres going around and production didn't allow bands to sound Br00tal   

ultmetal wrote:

Of course there are bands and songs that break the general rules. We're talking generalizations here.

One metalcore fan I was just speaking with on Facebook said,

Quote :

80's metal isn't heavy enough and shouldn't even be called heavy metal! It's all about the br00tal breakdowns!!! Breakdowns are metal!!!

That's the sort of stuff that makes me cringe.

That makes me cringe too, but a lot of Metalcore fans are not like that at all.

ultmetal wrote:

Of course there are bands and songs that break the general rules. We're talking generalizations here.

One metalcore fan I was just speaking with on Facebook said,

Quote :

80's metal isn't heavy enough and shouldn't even be called heavy metal! It's all about the br00tal breakdowns!!! Breakdowns are metal!!!

That's the sort of stuff that makes me cringe.

Well, you have to consider the source when entering these debates.

I've read this interesting thread, and I guess I'm not savvy enough to distinguish between what's metal and what's not metal. To me if the guitars are amplified, there's aggression, drums and bass, and a certain "feel" is accomplished...it's metal. Pink Cream 69 are a form of metal as are As I Lay Dying.

Not for one second do I listen to a Metalcore band and not think they're anything else than metal. I don't even really understand this discussion.

scottmitchell74 wrote:

ultmetal wrote:

Of course there are bands and songs that break the general rules. We're talking generalizations here.

One metalcore fan I was just speaking with on Facebook said,

Quote :

80's metal isn't heavy enough and shouldn't even be called heavy metal! It's all about the br00tal breakdowns!!! Breakdowns are metal!!!

That's the sort of stuff that makes me cringe.

Well, you have to consider the source when entering these debates.

I've read this interesting thread, and I guess I'm not savvy enough to distinguish between what's metal and what's not metal. To me if the guitars are amplified, there's aggression, drums and bass, and a certain "feel" is accomplished...it's metal. Pink Cream 69 are a form of metal as are As I Lay Dying.

Not for one second do I listen to a Metalcore band and not think they're anything else than metal. I don't even really understand this discussion.

Agreed.

scottmitchell74 wrote:

ultmetal wrote:

Of course there are bands and songs that break the general rules. We're talking generalizations here.

One metalcore fan I was just speaking with on Facebook said,

Quote :

80's metal isn't heavy enough and shouldn't even be called heavy metal! It's all about the br00tal breakdowns!!! Breakdowns are metal!!!

That's the sort of stuff that makes me cringe.

Well, you have to consider the source when entering these debates.

I've read this interesting thread, and I guess I'm not savvy enough to distinguish between what's metal and what's not metal. To me if the guitars are amplified, there's aggression, drums and bass, and a certain "feel" is accomplished...it's metal. Pink Cream 69 are a form of metal as are As I Lay Dying.

Not for one second do I listen to a Metalcore band and not think they're anything else than metal. I don't even really understand this discussion.

AMEN!!

DallasBlack wrote:

It's like the tomato being a fruit. There is no harm in letting someone believe a tomato is a vegetable.

Wow

Mind = blown

The topic itself is a:
 
*dude beating a dead horse*

It just depends on how you look at it. It's a combination of extreme metal and hardcore punk. So if you're an exclusionist, you'd call it impure and not metal. If you're an inclusionist you'd call it metal if it had some metal in it.

The former would probably say something like: "This music is not very good. Therefore it cannot be metal." Except on the internet you need to use hyperboles, so instead of "not very good", it's more often "GAY-ASS SHIT".

The inclusionist would go: "It is BOTH metal AND punk. And it's also techno because that one band had a DJ." It's also progressive. Because everything is progressive nowadays.[/i]

EDIT: miserable format and tags fail

Thanks for the input/discussion. See, that's what I like about this place. You can discuss stuff without it turning into stupidity. (Well, most of the time anyhow.   )

Lari wrote:

DallasBlack wrote:

It's like the tomato being a fruit. There is no harm in letting someone believe a tomato is a vegetable.

Wow

Mind = blown

The topic itself is a:
 
*dude beating a dead horse*

It just depends on how you look at it. It's a combination of extreme metal and hardcore punk. So if you're an exclusionist, you'd call it impure and not metal. If you're an inclusionist you'd call it metal if it had some metal in it.

The former would probably say something like: "This music is not very good. Therefore it cannot be metal." Except on the internet you need to use hyperboles, so instead of "not very good", it's more often "GAY-ASS SHIT".

The inclusionist would go: "It is BOTH metal AND punk. And it's also techno because that one band had a DJ." It's also progressive. Because everything is progressive nowadays.[/i]

EDIT: miserable format and tags fail

I hear no hardcore punk influences in Metalcore. The fact that punk has any relation to Metalcore makes me    To each their own I guess?

MetalRob331 wrote:

Lari wrote:

DallasBlack wrote:

It's like the tomato being a fruit. There is no harm in letting someone believe a tomato is a vegetable.

Wow

Mind = blown

The topic itself is a:
 
*dude beating a dead horse*

It just depends on how you look at it. It's a combination of extreme metal and hardcore punk. So if you're an exclusionist, you'd call it impure and not metal. If you're an inclusionist you'd call it metal if it had some metal in it.

The former would probably say something like: "This music is not very good. Therefore it cannot be metal." Except on the internet you need to use hyperboles, so instead of "not very good", it's more often "GAY-ASS SHIT".

The inclusionist would go: "It is BOTH metal AND punk. And it's also techno because that one band had a DJ." It's also progressive. Because everything is progressive nowadays.[/i]

EDIT: miserable format and tags fail

I hear no hardcore punk influences in Metalcore.  The fact that punk has any relation to Metalcore makes me     To each their own I guess?  

It depends on which bands you listen to, some like "Hogan's Heroes" "Earth Crisis" and "Integrity" are influenced by Hardcore Punk, whereas bands like Underoath, Devil Wears Prada and Killswitch Engage lean more towards metal.

MetalRob331 wrote:

Lari wrote:

DallasBlack wrote:

It's like the tomato being a fruit. There is no harm in letting someone believe a tomato is a vegetable.

Wow

Mind = blown

The topic itself is a:
 
*dude beating a dead horse*

It just depends on how you look at it. It's a combination of extreme metal and hardcore punk. So if you're an exclusionist, you'd call it impure and not metal. If you're an inclusionist you'd call it metal if it had some metal in it.

The former would probably say something like: "This music is not very good. Therefore it cannot be metal." Except on the internet you need to use hyperboles, so instead of "not very good", it's more often "GAY-ASS SHIT".

The inclusionist would go: "It is BOTH metal AND punk. And it's also techno because that one band had a DJ." It's also progressive. Because everything is progressive nowadays.[/i]

EDIT: miserable format and tags fail

I hear no hardcore punk influences in Metalcore.  The fact that punk has any relation to Metalcore makes me     To each their own I guess?  

Well, what is hardcore punk anyway? Guy yelling over loud guitars? There's plenty of that, at least.

Lari wrote:

MetalRob331 wrote:

Lari wrote:

DallasBlack wrote:

It's like the tomato being a fruit. There is no harm in letting someone believe a tomato is a vegetable.

Wow

Mind = blown

The topic itself is a:
 
*dude beating a dead horse*

It just depends on how you look at it. It's a combination of extreme metal and hardcore punk. So if you're an exclusionist, you'd call it impure and not metal. If you're an inclusionist you'd call it metal if it had some metal in it.

The former would probably say something like: "This music is not very good. Therefore it cannot be metal." Except on the internet you need to use hyperboles, so instead of "not very good", it's more often "GAY-ASS SHIT".

The inclusionist would go: "It is BOTH metal AND punk. And it's also techno because that one band had a DJ." It's also progressive. Because everything is progressive nowadays.[/i]

EDIT: miserable format and tags fail

I hear no hardcore punk influences in Metalcore.  The fact that punk has any relation to Metalcore makes me     To each their own I guess?  

Well, what is hardcore punk anyway? Guy yelling over loud guitars? There's plenty of that, at least.

I guess you can say that lol

This thread won't be complete until Eyesore and Monty show up.

Give them time. They are some of the only posters on here who seem to post past 10pm.

.

Fat Freddy wrote:

I don't know enough about the genre to make the call one way or another. All I know is it seems to be made by people a lot younger and angrier than I am and it's got them WOOOOAAARRRRGH vox I don't like. Get off my lawn ya dang angry kids. (shakes cane)

  
yeah, I'm old(er) too and couldn't agree more…….

onrypt wrote:

Fat Freddy wrote:

I don't know enough about the genre to make the call one way or another. All I know is it seems to be made by people a lot younger and angrier than I am and it's got them WOOOOAAARRRRGH vox I don't like. Get off my lawn ya dang angry kids. (shakes cane)

  
yeah, I'm old(er) too and couldn't agree more…….

very true. Kids today go for loud and angry music.

they do not care about melodies and solos.

I don't know or really even care if it's "tr00" metal, hardcore, or whatever. It's heavy, catchy & I like a ton of it.

I do know that it's not altogether that different from metal or hardcore in a lot of ways. Metal & hardcore fans are just so elitist they spit at anything that falls somewhat outside the very basic description of what they think they are defending is.

In the end of things, it's all pop music.

Metalcore is metal, though it's a very broad genre, like nu-metal, where one metalcore band can be vastly different from another. This just becomes argument fodder for the close-minded. Either way, it's definitely metal.

How is this not metal?





Of course it is.

I would have to agree with Eyesore,it's metal whether some like it or not.gotta love all these sub-genres nowadays!

I also think that many people that listen to metalcore, the fans (i am not talking about the band members) are not into traditional heavy metal, they just listen to metalcore. Its like today with METALLICA or IRON MAIDEN. 90% of their fans are not really into heavy metal. They just play records by those two bands and go see them live, thats it. Still the bands playes metal even if the fans are not metalheads.
Still i think metalcore is metal (when it has more metal then hc influences because some of those bands are heavy influenced by thrash or by more classic heavy metal) but its not heavy metal in my opinión SCOTT. Heavy metal is to me MAIDEN, ENFORCER, SKULL FIST, STRIKER, JUDAS, ACCEPT... but metalcore and heavy metal falls under the name of METAL!!!!, its all metal.

.

I liked a handful of metalcore bands in the late 90's and early 2k's. I can still listen to Aftershock and enjoy them. Most of the bands that I liked were on Tribunal Records also a few European ones like Caliban, Reprisal and Heaven Shall Burn. At that time I was in my mid to late 20's and it was something kinda new and different. I think that is why it appealed to me. I have no idea who the metalcore bands are today. I was in for about 2 years and that was it. Went back and tried to listen to those cd's again and they just don't hold up for me. That said, I have a handful of metalcore CD's from that era that I no longer want if anyone is interested in them, mostly Tribunal Records stuff.

I'd say it's metal just not a type I enjoy.