Flotsam & Jetsam - Cuatro

was this album really as bad as the reviews suggest? i think it's an amazing record. Erik A.K. especially.... he really shines on this one. thrash? not at all, but some really great metal here!

I think it was similar to Testament's The Ritual - they knew the thrash era is over and didnt know what to do, so they played "safe" writing a heavy metal album. Unfortunately it came quite bland and boring. IMHO at least.

Yeah, back in the days when Thrash bands wanted a piece of the Seattle Sound, or at least tone-down a bit in order to cater those Grunge fans

'Cuatro' wasn't their style to begin with ... When you have your favorite band responding to Record Company pressure like that, you know it'll going to suck ... OTOH, I kinda liked 'The Ritual' ...

Cuatro was my first Flots album. I think it's one of their best and the production is excellent. There was nothing Grunge about it...

Cuatro was one of my first Flots albums also. Never understood the disdain for it. I think it's great.

It wasn't my first Flots album, but I got it pretty early on so I never had any issues with it. It's not their best work, but it's certainly not the dog some folks would make you believe.

mc666 wrote:

was this album really as bad as the reviews suggest?

No, and in fact, I just re-wrote my review of that album.

I'm not getting the grunge issue, thrash wasn't taking the beating hair metal was, maybe they just wanted to do a different type of album.

Dark Horseman wrote:

I'm not getting the grunge issue, thrash wasn't taking the beating hair metal was, maybe they just wanted to do a different type of album.

You don't get it because grunge has NOTHING to do with this. It's a "post-Black Album" release, people seem to forget that Metallica record had ALOT to do with the directional changes similar bands tried post-1991.

I don't think it had to do with Grunge. I think the band needed a change in sound. "When the Storm Came Down" was a flop and didn't have the energy or the songs that "Doomsday" or "No Place for Disgrace" had. It was time for a change and "Cuatro" is what they came up with. It's still heavy metal, it's just not thrash metal.

I also agree that Metallica's success might have had a hand in the sound of "Cuatro".

I can see Black album having more influence then grunge. So i'm not totally crazy.

I dig this album. I no longer own it, though. Sold all my Flotsam long ago in the Air Force. Been meaning to rectify that.

Anyway, I enjoyed the album quite a bit. But it came out right around the time I was really branching out and exploring other styles of music. All the so-called "sell-out" albums by metal bands came out at that time, so that's why I enjoy them all. Haha. To me, that was the band, you know.

Its a great album some people just don't like change. As long as its done right its fine and this is one of those albums.

ultmetal wrote:

mc666 wrote:

was this album really as bad as the reviews suggest?

No, and in fact, I just re-wrote my review of that album.

that's good. i look forward to reading it.

S.D. wrote:

Dark Horseman wrote:

I'm not getting the grunge issue, thrash wasn't taking the beating hair metal was, maybe they just wanted to do a different type of album.

You don't get it because grunge has NOTHING to do with this. It's a "post-Black Album" release, people seem to forget that Metallica record had ALOT to do with the directional changes similar bands tried post-1991.

+1. Same happend with I HEAR BLACK by OVERKILL or THE RITUAL by TESTAMENT.

I think Cuatro is a really good album. Nothing horrible or "grunge-y" about it to me.

I agree with those who say that grunge had nothing to do with so many thrash bands changing their sound. It's not like any of them became grunge bands. A lot of these albums are more in the vein of the Black Album than anything.

Quote :

All the so-called "sell-out" albums by metal bands came out at that time

I always dug all those albums. My take was good for them if it'll break them bigger. If I liked it, why should I hate on them for trying to sell a few more records or reaching a broader audience.

I think the change that most of those bands did in the early 90's was much needed. They had to break up the monotony of just playing fast all the time. Even Slayer eventually joined them when they put out Diabolus in Musica.

Love Cuatro even if it wasn't my first F&H album (which it was). Favorite songs are Double Zero, Natural Enemies, Hypodermic Midnight Snack, Are You Ready, Secret Square, and Swatting At Flies.

I saw F&J on the tour for this album and thought the songs sounded way better live than on disc. I've owned Cuatro twice in the past (once on cassette and again years later on CD) and it didn't do much for me either time.

I haven't gave this one a listen in years. Not god awful, but nothing that really clicked with me. Flotsam is a band I think is guilty of trying too hard to be different or original. It's clear that they wanted to distance themselves somewhat from the thrash bands of the time, but the change in direction didn't sound always very natural. Having said that, I'm sure some of their later records were probably worse than this one.

I need this one still. Have seen a copy for 3.99 for the past few weeks and am always tempted but haven't gone for it yet

It's a really solid album. Swatting Flies is killer.

Anybody heard the Metal mind remaster? (Not that there's anything wrong with the original version)

Troublezone wrote:

I think the change that most of those bands did in the early 90's was much needed. They had to break up the monotony of just playing fast all the time. Even Slayer eventually joined them when they put out Diabolus in Musica.

Slayer might have even been first with South of Heaven. but yeah, i agree. albums like Sound of White Noise, The Ritual, Distortion, Act III, Something Wicked this Way Comes, Countdown To Extinction, Reborn Dogs, Art of Rebellion, Force of Habit, Metallica, Cuatro, Renewal, I Hear Black, & King of the Kill were very important in continuing the genre, without just copying it.