$layer controversy with Lombardo ... Your take?

That's the point, none of us know the business dealings of any of these guys, none of us know the interpersonal relationships of the individual members. From what I've read in an interview with Tom, Dave was a partner in the business until 1991 and since then he hasn't been and has been working for them as a hired gun, (so I would assume that at some point he has been paid for his stake in the band) and that rather than discussing any grievance he may have had with regards to money, he took to twitter or facebook (I can't remember which) to slag off the other guys. For that reason, Kerry, Tom & Jeff agreed that he had to go. I have no idea whether Dave was getting screwed over by the band (I have no idea what the going rate is for a top class drummer in a reasonably successful metal band is) I just know that I'll miss his talent in Slayer and so will Slayer.

I don't hold out much hope for the future of the band, but think that it's a little wide of the mark to think that they can't to anything good. Kerry has written some good stuff over the years and Gary Holt and Paul Bostaph are hardly a couple of homeless winos dragged in off the street to make up the numbers so if they (particularly Gary) are allowed to contribute then it could be decent (although maybe not classic Slayer)

I think it's just pretty fun to bash them because Kerry comes off like a giant chasm of an asshole and Tom looks like he's spent the last 20 years real high and for that reason I think that the next record will suck, but it's far from a certainty.

Yeah, I really hate when people take their inter-band squabbles public. I'm sure they feel they have a good reason to do it that way. But as a fan it just makes me cringe. And with the social media phenom it has gotten insane. Easier said than done, but take that stuff behind close doors and work something out. Or take legal remedy if that fails.

I think Tom just wants to stay away from the drama.  He lives in east Texas with his family and Slayer is pretty much just his day job at this point.  His writing partner was Jeff and he has expressed frustration in the past with Kerry who doesn't want any input into songs he writes, so I can't imagine the prospect of doing an album where Kerry writes every song will be a happy arrangement for him.  Maybe Kerry will allow Holt to contribute a little and there's still a chance they may use some of the material Jeff was working on before he passed.  

I've been listening to Slayer since the Haunting The Chapel EP came out in 1984 so of course I'll listen to the new record, I'm just not jumping up and down with excitement.

I don't get Kerry King. Dude is just a bad soloist, and even he's admitted to it. Jeff had the better arrangements in the band. The only thing King has ever had going for him was his stage presence, which was pretty terrifying, but today he looks kind of goofy onstage. So I don't understand his ego, I guess is what I'm saying. It's like that Beastie Boys video where he muscles the gorilla. That seems to be his aim in life. It's left a bit of a sour taste in my mouth for whenever I see him. For example, a great song until he shows up at 2:35 and practically ruins everything:

I don't really mind King's soloing, he's a one-trick pony and always has been, but I never felt Slayer needed much more than that, the solos were always as insane and over the top as everything else. It fit the material.

Jeff was a far, far worse soloist.  Jeff never played a solo in his life as good as Kerry's in "War Ensemble".

Temple of Blood wrote:

Jeff was a far, far worse soloist.  Jeff never played a solo in his life as good as Kerry's in "War Ensemble".

See, I disagree, Jeff was noisier for sure, but I preferred the attitude he brought to his solos, far more interesting than Kerry speed picking throughout. Even recently I loved Jeff's solo for the title track of World Painted Blood. Neither one of them were technically good guitarists, but as I said before it worked for Slayer.

S.D. wrote:

Temple of Blood wrote:

Jeff was a far, far worse soloist.  Jeff never played a solo in his life as good as Kerry's in "War Ensemble".

See, I disagree, Jeff was noisier for sure, but I preferred the attitude he brought to his solos, far more interesting than Kerry speed picking throughout.  Even recently I loved Jeff's solo for the title track of World Painted Blood.  Neither one of them were technically good guitarists, but as I said before it worked for Slayer.

That's what I'm saying. Jeff had style. Kerry is amateur night. My requirements for guitarists have never been that they shred like Sach (although I'm beginning to wonder if I've been misunderstood around here on that topic), it's that they think outside of the box and not be so lackluster/unoriginal/passive. Creativity and inspiration (Jeff) trump [faux] speed and reckless abandon (King).

Temple of Blood wrote:

Well said Mr. veins.

Who said he was starving anyway?  That's beside the point.

Sorry, I wasn't being clear. Where I'm from if you say someone is "not starving" it just means that you think they have sufficient money that there's no need to be concerned about them. That's what I'm saying about Dave Lombardo.

Witchfinder wrote:

Those numbers seem weird to me.  The band gets only 10%?  Baffling. Seems like shenanigans have occured.  I would definitely ask for a full accounting and recompense.

I agree, that sounds fishy, and what band would agree to only getting 10% of what they have earned?

manny wrote:

Witchfinder wrote:

Those numbers seem weird to me.  The band gets only 10%?  Baffling. Seems like shenanigans have occured.  I would definitely ask for a full accounting and recompense.

I agree, that sounds fishy, and what band would agree to only getting 10% of what they have earned?

As I stated above, it would not surprise me of King (and even Araya) have some sort of stake in their own management company, or other such arrangements that allow them to get some of that other 90% in various ways.

Example: Sammy Hagar legally started his own travel agency on paper, which allows him to get paid to book his own flights. His reasoning was "Why am I paying anyone X% to book flights for me? I'll pay myself to do that." It's probably pretty common business practice among larger, more established bands like that.

Jeff played a lot of the worst solos in metal history. Loads of bum notes and out of key bends. It doesn't "work" any more than singing a lot of out of key notes "works". He obviously put very little time or effort into his solos.

Temple of Blood wrote:

Jeff played a lot of the worst solos in metal history.  

Hyperbolic bullshit post of the day.

Not at all. All the popular metal bands had better solos than Jeff: METALLICA, IRON MAIDEN, JUDAS PRIEST, MEGADETH, ANTHRAX, BLACK SABBATH, QUEENSYCHE, etc. etc. etc.

Temple of Blood wrote:

Not at all.  All the popular metal bands had better solos than Jeff:  METALLICA, IRON MAIDEN, JUDAS PRIEST, MEGADETH, ANTHRAX, BLACK SABBATH, QUEENSYCHE, etc. etc. etc.  

Not surprisingly you're missing the picture because you're standing too close to the painting, agonizing over the brush strokes.

Temple of Blood wrote:

Not at all.  All the popular metal bands had better solos than Jeff:  METALLICA, IRON MAIDEN, JUDAS PRIEST, MEGADETH, ANTHRAX, BLACK SABBATH, QUEENSYCHE, etc. etc. etc.  

All of those bands had great guitarists, but you said "in metal history"



Are you absolutely sure about that?   

What I was trying to say, is that I'm sure that you can find some Z-level bands out there who did solos worse than Jeff's ...

But if you were writing a book on metal history, and talking about the top 50 or so metal bands of all-times, and you had to list the worst solos of them all, they would be Jeff's.

I did like his solos on "Show No Mercy" a lot more than the ones he did later on.

I'm looking at the painting to appreciate its art, and not treating the artist as a flawless demigod. Metal loves its sacred cows.

Temple of Blood wrote:

But if you were writing a book on metal history, and talking about the top 50 or so metal bands of all-times, and you had to list the worst solos of them all, they would be Jeff's.

YOUR OPINION, and it is nothing more than opinion.

OK ... so what solos from the top 50 metal bands of all-time would be worse than Jeff's?

I mean, off the top of my head, the solo he did from "Seasons in the Abyss" is laughably bad.

Temple of Blood wrote:

OK ... so what solos from the top 50 metal bands of all-time would be worse than Jeff's?

I mean, off the top of my head, the solo he did from "Seasons in the Abyss" is laughably bad.

I'm not wasting my time comparing the technical facility of a bunch of different guitarists like it's some kind of dick-measuring contest.  You couldn't even get a consensus to agree on the "top 50 metal bands of all-time" anyway, so it's a completely wasted effort.

Temple of Blood wrote:

OK ... so what solos from the top 50 metal bands of all-time would be worse than Jeff's?

Anything Kerry King.   

Seriously, though, as a guitarist I've always admired Jeff's lead work in the same way I've admired Bobby Gustafson's: he's no virtuoso, but he's got tons of character, which augments the song.

Jeff and Kerry are not known for their lead guitar, therefore that point is moot. Those guys were rhythm guitar players who happened to play leads. Their chaotic almost wailing style worked for what Slayer was all about IMO!!

Two great men once said: Chaos don't give a f***!

Mick Mars & CC Deville!   

Boris2008 wrote:

Mick Mars & CC Deville!   

Both very good guitar players.