U.S. Judge Overturns Proposition 8

Eyesore wrote:

James B. wrote:

Eyesore said...

Quote :

Not really. You can hide your sexuality. You can't hide your color. Big difference. Those who could not hide their sexuality, for whatever reason, being caught, being too open and having too much faith in humanity's tolerance for such things, found themselves on the receiving end of the same sort of discrimination, torture, and most often death.

I can see your point but the level of persecution isn't even close to being the same.

eyesore said

Quote :

Nonsense.

just your opinion... I have a choice regarding everything I do in my life. If you believe otherwise than you are limiting yourself in the dynamic of living your life and giving control of your life to a behavior or an action as opposed to yourself.

We have choices, of course, but that's too easy an excuse. ga-hey men and women act straight all the time to please those who refuse to accept them otherwise. Can you, right now, stop being attracted to women? Can you? Doubtful.

Why wouldnt he be able to act ga-hey when gays can act straight?

Eyesore wrote:

James B. wrote:

Eyesore said...

Quote :

Not really. You can hide your sexuality. You can't hide your color. Big difference. Those who could not hide their sexuality, for whatever reason, being caught, being too open and having too much faith in humanity's tolerance for such things, found themselves on the receiving end of the same sort of discrimination, torture, and most often death.

I can see your point but the level of persecution isn't even close to being the same.

eyesore said

Quote :

Nonsense.

just your opinion... I have a choice regarding everything I do in my life. If you believe otherwise than you are limiting yourself in the dynamic of living your life and giving control of your life to a behavior or an action as opposed to yourself.

We have choices, of course, but that's too easy an excuse. ga-hey men and women act straight all the time to please those who refuse to accept them otherwise. Can you, right now, stop being attracted to women? Can you? Doubtful.

Why should what you do in the privacy of your bedroom dictate how you behave in public ? The act of homosexual behavior may be something a person is born with or not ? The behavior of acting "ga-hey" is totaly a learned behavior and has nothing to do with predisposition at birth.

As to your question regarding attraction. I developed my preference after experiencing it. I have a choice to experience being attracted to men but choose not to do so. I have friends who "experimeted" with both and some made the choice to enjoy both, while others made the choice of sticking with just one sex. They ALL have the belief they they did have a curiosity and attraction and made a preference after the experiences. The basic, "tried it and liked it" perspective of why they choose to live that particular lifestyle.

If I offended anyone, that wasn't my intention. Forgive me.

No you are not offending anyone James B, it is cool.

I did not develop attraction to girls, I just liked them as I got older they went from having cooties to me wanting to be near them. At 12 I had no experience with girls, hell I could barely talk to them without turning red, but I was natuarally attracted to them.

James B. wrote:

Why should what you do in the privacy of your bedroom dictate how you behave in public ? The act of homosexual behavior may be something a person is born with or not ? The behavior of acting "ga-hey" is totaly a learned behavior and has nothing to do with predisposition at birth.

This I can agree with. I have an old friend who was my best friend growing up, all the way into high school, and then we lost touch. A few years ago his brother was killed, so I went to the wake. Hadn't seen him in years. I noticed he sounded different, thought maybe he was drunk. Haha. Then he was with a girl a lot while I was there, so I said, "This your girlfriend?" And he goes, "Um, no. I'm ga-hey." WTF? Haha. Looking back, okay...I can see where he may have been ga-hey, but he sure as hell had no lisp! Lame.

But this is no different than black guys that may not have grown up in the hood who begin to hang with those more "urban" type of people later in life, and then they too begin talking like that. Hell, you put any white person around a group of black people and you'll hear them immediately try to fit in by saying things like "nah" instead of "no" and stuff. Haha.

Yeah, kind of lame, and definitely not anything that has to do with biological or physiological makeup, but it is human nature to do this sort of thing.

Quote :

As to your question regarding attraction. I developed my preference after experiencing it. I have a choice to experience being attracted to men but choose not to do so. I have friends who "experimeted" with both and some made the choice to enjoy both, while others made the choice of sticking with just one sex. They ALL have the belief they they did have a curiosity and attraction and made a preference after the experiences. The basic, "tried it and liked it" perspective of why they choose to live that particular lifestyle.

If I offended anyone, that wasn't my intention. Forgive me.

You can't experience being attracted to anything, not like it's some sort of amusement park ride or anything. You either are or you aren't. It's that simple.

I'm like an amusement park ride.

Orion Crystal Ice wrote:

I'm like an amusement park ride.

How tall do I have to be?

I think we should outlaw Ted Nugent. I would support any legislation that tacked on and snuck through that rider!

Of course, that would open up all kinds of Anti-Axl Rose opportunities..... thusly restoring my faith in the democratic process.

Ahhh - nature vs environmental determinism. What is know is that sexual identity is determine by age 5. What is not know if it is a product of environment or something a person is born with.

People have been debating that one for ages. What I don't get is why LGBT folks insist it is genetic. It may be, it may not be. I personally think it is developed by age 5 and not necessarily a gene. I also don't think someone what up and and decides "Hmm.... I just decided I am happy"

thejokeriv wrote:

Ahhh - nature vs environmental determinism. What is know is that sexual identity is determine by age 5. What is not know if it is a product of environment or something a person is born with.

People have been debating that one for ages. What I don't get is why LGBT folks insist it is genetic. It may be, it may not be. I personally think it is developed by age 5 and not necessarily a gene. I also don't think someone what up and and decides "Hmm.... I just decided I am happy"

Interesting video. You can skip to the 4 minute mark: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t_NNU7bBGgc

SpectreFate wrote:

Is there any science that proves that Jesus ascended to Heaven?

and Christians who claim to 'know' get ridiculed and called intellectual morons and the like. Now that those who claim to be homosexual cannot offer scientific proof, its enough to say they 'know' and everyone accepts it as fact. Where is the integrity to apply the standard to both cases?

Eyesore wrote:

We have choices, of course, but that's too easy an excuse. ga-hey men and women act straight all the time to please those who refuse to accept them otherwise. Can you, right now, stop being attracted to women? Can you? Doubtful.

There are lots of people who are bi-sexual. Should we allow those people to marry one of each? I think you can make an argument that making them choose would go against their nature if you accept the 'we are made that way' line of thought.

It is possible to control yourself and make choices on how you behave. People make choices to become dependent on things - from those who are compulsive shoppers, eaters, gamblers, drinkers to those who are sexual addicts. It may not be easy to control once you give in to a behavior, but it can be done.

Personally, I dont want the government intervening in what goes on in the bedroom. As a conservative, I believe that whatever goes on in the bedroom is between you and your mate. I think most people share this attitude and where the disagreement comes in is over the public expression. For ages marriage has been between a man and a woman. Civil unions provide the same benefits as marriage. It is a new class of union for those who engage in relationships that do not conform to the traditional nature of marriage. Whether one is joined in civil union or marriage, the view under law is the same. All this is just because one group wants to claim to be 'married'.

In the end all this does nothing to foster acceptance and actually creates more division and dislike between the factions.

exact33 wrote:

There are lots of people who are bi-sexual. Should we allow those people to marry one of each? I think you can make an argument that making them choose would go against their nature if you accept the 'we are made that way' line of thought.

You would also have to consider the polygamists.... who do exist.

exact33 wrote:

Personally, I dont want the government intervening in what goes on in the bedroom. As a conservative, I believe that whatever goes on in the bedroom is between you and your mate. I think most people share this attitude and where the disagreement comes in is over the public expression. For ages marriage has been between a man and a woman. Civil unions provide the same benefits as marriage. It is a new class of union for those who engage in relationships that do not conform to the traditional nature of marriage. Whether one is joined in civil union or marriage, the view under law is the same. All this is just because one group wants to claim to be 'married'.

The last thing you need is the Federal Govt. defining what marriage is..... It is a state matter anyway or every state would have the same parental constent marrying age (I think I said it correctly).

[quote="manny"]

chewie wrote:

exact33 wrote:

exact33 wrote:

Personally, I dont want the government intervening in what goes on in the bedroom. As a conservative, I believe that whatever goes on in the bedroom is between you and your mate. I think most people share this attitude and where the disagreement comes in is over the public expression. For ages marriage has been between a man and a woman. Civil unions provide the same benefits as marriage. It is a new class of union for those who engage in relationships that do not conform to the traditional nature of marriage. Whether one is joined in civil union or marriage, the view under law is the same. All this is just because one group wants to claim to be 'married'.

The last thing you need is the Federal Govt. defining what marriage is..... It is a state matter anyway or every state would have the same parental constent marrying age (I think I said it correctly).

You stated correctly and that is correct for example California may recongize a ga-hey/lesbian marriage but Florida does not have to legally recongize it

and I dont have a problem if another state chooses, through its own elections, not to recognize a civil union. States do have other issues that other states do not recognize and I dont see why this should be any different.

Very true exact, and as I stated before I am all for civil unions/ga-hey marriages but I also do not feel this is a federal issue, it is a state and local issue.

manny wrote:

Very true exact, and as I stated before I am all for civil unions/ga-hey marriages but I also do not feel this is a federal issue, it is a state and local issue.

I would agree with you - this is not a federal issue at all. Leave it up to each of the states to decide for themselves whether or not to recognize civil unions.

Too bad this happened. It will only be a matter of time before its reversed again banning this dispicable practice.

I'm not religious in any way but God created Adam and Eve NOT Adam and Steve.

Lurideath wrote:

Too bad this happened. It will only be a matter of time before its reversed again banning this dispicable practice.

I'm not religious in any way but God created Adam and Eve NOT Adam and Steve.

shannon - the one thing I have always appreciated about you is that you dont mince words

Lurideath wrote:

Too bad this happened. It will only be a matter of time before its reversed again banning this dispicable practice.

I'm not religious in any way but God created Adam and Eve NOT Adam and Steve.

I have this sudden urge to hit on you now.

Hey there, hot stuff...

Schbopo wrote:

Lurideath wrote:

Too bad this happened. It will only be a matter of time before its reversed again banning this dispicable practice.

I'm not religious in any way but God created Adam and Eve NOT Adam and Steve.

I have this sudden urge to hit on you now.

Hey there, hot stuff...

you wouldnt like Shannon when he is mad

Schbopo wrote:

Lurideath wrote:

Too bad this happened. It will only be a matter of time before its reversed again banning this dispicable practice.

I'm not religious in any way but God created Adam and Eve NOT Adam and Steve.

I have this sudden urge to hit on you now.

Hey there, hot stuff...

Yeah i guess angry bald drummers in leather and spikes must be hard to resist if you are going down that road