Poll: The Best Mid-80s UK Band's American Sellout Record

Boris2008 wrote:

Witchfinder wrote:

There was a silver lining though because this move probably forced the band to avoid the pitfall that so many other metal bands fell into the early 90s - the grunge sellout. Saxon never did this, so in retrospect, their failed commercial bid probably ensured the long term survival of the band.

I'm sorry but I'm laughing my ass off at the thought of Saxon as a grunge band!!

I always felt Strong Arm of the Law & Wheels of Steel needed some yarling

SpectreFate wrote:

Quote :

Man...I can't believe all this nonsense I'm reading about 'Painkiller' being (paraphrased) a "lame attempt at speed metal". That album f'n rules!

Meh.

"Meh." YOUR FACE!!!!

I picked "Something Else" cuz my vote would go to Raven's The Pack Is Back...even though it's a total clusterf*ck of pure '80s high-gloss major label cheez-metal that utterly destroyed the band's career, I'm such a Raven fanboy that I actually still kinda like most of that album.

DEF LEPPARD & WHITESNAKE - Hysteria and 1987 - absolute dross. One went from metal to pop, and the other went from Blues hard rock to God only knows what?

Fat Freddy wrote:

I picked "Something Else" cuz my vote would go to Raven's The Pack Is Back...even though it's a total clusterf*ck of pure '80s high-gloss major label cheez-metal that utterly destroyed the band's career, I'm such a Raven fanboy that I actually still kinda like most of that album.

Poor old Raven - in form they were unstoppable- but the guitarist had his legs crushed when a wall fell on him, and any chance of RAVEN making it, vanished from that point. I love all their old ass kicking early 80's music.

Fat Freddy wrote:

I picked "Something Else" cuz my vote would go to Raven's The Pack Is Back...even though it's a total clusterf*ck of pure '80s high-gloss major label cheez-metal that utterly destroyed the band's career, I'm such a Raven fanboy that I actually still kinda like most of that album.

Good pick! That kind of album is exactly what I am talking about.

I think Turbo is kind of charming in its cheesiness. I love those "teen metal anthem" songs, lame as they are (especially since there's a noticeable lack of them nowadays).

Chrome Locust wrote:

Fat Freddy wrote:

I picked "Something Else" cuz my vote would go to Raven's The Pack Is Back...even though it's a total clusterf*ck of pure '80s high-gloss major label cheez-metal that utterly destroyed the band's career, I'm such a Raven fanboy that I actually still kinda like most of that album.

Poor old Raven - in form they were unstoppable- but the guitarist had his legs crushed when a wall fell on him, and any chance of RAVEN making it, vanished from that point. I love all their old ass kicking early 80's music.

The ship had sailed on Raven ever "making it" long before Mark (guitarist)'s leg injuries. The Pack Is Back album which torpedo'd their career (at least on a major label level) was released in 1986. They kept on releasing albums on smaller labels for a cult audience, of course, but they never got another "shot at the big time" after that album.

Mark's accident happened in 1999 or 2000, right after the release of their One For All record. Which was a bummer, cuz they were on the verge of making a bit of an "underground" comeback with that album. Unfortunately the accident put the band out of commission for almost ten years.

Witchfinder wrote:

Boris2008 wrote:

I'd probably say The Cult - Electric.

Surprised that Def Leppard - Pyromania isn't up on the list.

Good choices!

I would have added Raven's "Stay Hard" as well. This was my intro to Raven's metal might. I had heard the cassette and was not impressed at all, therefore I totally avoided them until I heard "All For One." After hearing "All For One" I really started to like Raven quite a bit.

jettafiend wrote:

I would have added Raven's "Stay Hard" as well. This was my intro to Raven's metal might. I had heard the cassette and was not impressed at all, therefore I totally avoided them until I heard "All For One." After hearing "All For One" I really started to like Raven quite a bit.

Stay Hard was the first Raven album I ever heard so it's still a sentimental favorite. I didn't understand why there seemed to be so much hate for it at the time, till I finally heard All For One, Wiped Out, and Rock Until You Drop and realized that the Powers that Be at their major label had neutered a very powerful band. I still dig the album though.

Besides, even as sterile/radio friendly as Stay Hard can be at times, it doesn't quite sink to the depths of utter cheesiness that The Pack Is Back does.

Fat Freddy wrote:

jettafiend wrote:

I would have added Raven's "Stay Hard" as well. This was my intro to Raven's metal might. I had heard the cassette and was not impressed at all, therefore I totally avoided them until I heard "All For One." After hearing "All For One" I really started to like Raven quite a bit.

Stay Hard was the first Raven album I ever heard so it's still a sentimental favorite. I didn't understand why there seemed to be so much hate for it at the time, till I finally heard All For One, Wiped Out, and Rock Until You Drop and realized that the Powers that Be at their major label had neutered a very powerful band. I still dig the album though.

Besides, even as sterile/radio friendly as Stay Hard can be at times, it still doesn't quite plumb the depths of utter cheesiness that The Pack Is Back does.

"The Pack is Back" is one of those albums that I have not heard. I may have to check it out based on the cheese factor alone. I voted for "Somewhere in Time" as this is my favorite Maiden album, hands down. "Wasted Years" and "Stranger in a Strange Land" are fantastic songs, IMHO.

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"The Pack is Back" is one of those albums that I have not heard. I may have to check it out based on the cheese factor alone.

It makes Stay Hard sound like grindcore by comparison.

For Pack Is Back, Atlantic put Raven in the studio with Eddie Kramer (producer of KISS, Hendrix, etc.) who gave'em a high-gloss, Judas Priest Turbo style production job that just drained away whatever energy the songs might have had. I swear that someone at the label must've heard that Priest were messing with guitar synths on their album and said "Hey, we got a bunch of British metal dudes too, let's make'em do the same thing."

John Gallagher (Raven bassist/vocalist) summed their entire Pack is Back/major label experience up by saying "Atlantic didn't look at us for what we were. They looked at us for what we could be. They wanted us to be KISS meets Bon Jovi. Not a good thing."

Fat Freddy wrote:

Quote :

"The Pack is Back" is one of those albums that I have not heard. I may have to check it out based on the cheese factor alone.

It makes Stay Hard sound like grindcore by comparison.

For Pack Is Back, Atlantic put Raven in the studio with Eddie Kramer (producer of KISS, Hendrix, etc.) who gave'em a high-gloss, Judas Priest Turbo style production job that just drained away whatever energy the songs might have had. I swear that someone at the label must've heard that Priest were messing with guitar synths on their album and said "Hey, we got a bunch of British metal dudes too, let's make'em do the same thing."

John Gallagher (Raven bassist/vocalist) summed their entire Pack is Back/major label experience up by saying "Atlantic didn't look at us for what we were. They looked at us for what we could be. They wanted us to be KISS meets Bon Jovi. Not a good thing."

80's Kiss is probably my favorite era of the band, but I digress... Raven is not nor will ever be Kiss. I actually feel fortunate that I missed the 80's so that when I hear stuff like "Turbo" I can enjoy it with perspective that is not tainted by previous experience (Like stupid record exec's) and just enjoy it for what it is. Can you imagine what Raven would have become if Bruce Fairbairn or "Mutt" Lange had produced it?

When I first heard "Stay Hard" I was into hair metal in a big way. Lots of Stryper, Poison, Warrant, Danger Danger, etc. The sound of John Gallagher's voice was really different, and they didn't have a lot of those harmonized background vocals that "Hysteria" or "To Hell with the Devil" had. This was like 8th-9th grade. Once I got into heavier stuff like Tourniquet and Megadeth, I really started to enjoy Raven. My ears had to mature musically before I really started to appreciate and enjoy the music.

jettafiend wrote:

Fat Freddy wrote:

jettafiend wrote:

I would have added Raven's "Stay Hard" as well. This was my intro to Raven's metal might. I had heard the cassette and was not impressed at all, therefore I totally avoided them until I heard "All For One." After hearing "All For One" I really started to like Raven quite a bit.

Stay Hard was the first Raven album I ever heard so it's still a sentimental favorite. I didn't understand why there seemed to be so much hate for it at the time, till I finally heard All For One, Wiped Out, and Rock Until You Drop and realized that the Powers that Be at their major label had neutered a very powerful band. I still dig the album though.

Besides, even as sterile/radio friendly as Stay Hard can be at times, it still doesn't quite plumb the depths of utter cheesiness that The Pack Is Back does.

"The Pack is Back" is one of those albums that I have not heard. I may have to check it out based on the cheese factor alone. I voted for "Somewhere in Time" as this is my favorite Maiden album, hands down. "Wasted Years" and "Stranger in a Strange Land" are fantastic songs, IMHO.

I dug "The Pack Is Back" yes it's very commercial by the bands stnadards, but i'll be damned if it isn't catchy as hell!

I wouldn't be able to decide between The Pack Is Back or Stay Hard. I still really dig both those albums. And at the time they were released I just viewed them as a logical progression for Raven. Seemed like everyone was swinging for a hit and playing for the mainstream - so why not Raven as well, I figured. I'll also say Saxon's Destiny would be up there for me as a "sellout" record I love.

jettafiend wrote:

Fat Freddy wrote:

Quote :

"The Pack is Back" is one of those albums that I have not heard. I may have to check it out based on the cheese factor alone.

It makes Stay Hard sound like grindcore by comparison.

For Pack Is Back, Atlantic put Raven in the studio with Eddie Kramer (producer of KISS, Hendrix, etc.) who gave'em a high-gloss, Judas Priest Turbo style production job that just drained away whatever energy the songs might have had. I swear that someone at the label must've heard that Priest were messing with guitar synths on their album and said "Hey, we got a bunch of British metal dudes too, let's make'em do the same thing."

John Gallagher (Raven bassist/vocalist) summed their entire Pack is Back/major label experience up by saying "Atlantic didn't look at us for what we were. They looked at us for what we could be. They wanted us to be KISS meets Bon Jovi. Not a good thing."

80's Kiss is probably my favorite era of the band, but I digress... Raven is not nor will ever be Kiss. I actually feel fortunate that I missed the 80's so that when I hear stuff like "Turbo" I can enjoy it with perspective that is not tainted by previous experience (Like stupid record exec's) and just enjoy it for what it is. Can you imagine what Raven would have become if Bruce Fairbairn or "Mutt" Lange had produced it?

When I first heard "Stay Hard" I was into hair metal in a big way. Lots of Stryper, Poison, Warrant, Danger Danger, etc. The sound of John Gallagher's voice was really different, and they didn't have a lot of those harmonized background vocals that "Hysteria" or "To Hell with the Devil" had. This was like 8th-9th grade. Once I got into heavier stuff like Tourniquet and Megadeth, I really started to enjoy Raven. My ears had to mature musically before I really started to appreciate and enjoy the music.

I think Eddie Kramer looks great on paper, but Atlantic hired him to make Raven into a pop metal band, and both he and the band released an album that neither one where happy with. Kramer collected a paycheck and Atlantic after spending all this money to make this album, to hire Eddie Kramer, just dropped the album and did not even bother promoting it. I personally like the album maybe because like FF I am such a fanboy I can't bring myself to say anything bad about Raven.

There are a few bands like that for me as well, Def Leppard and Saxon being two of them. I don't own any Saxon albums other than greatest hits but I have heard most everything by them. I slag "Hysteria" but it's in jest because I am so sick of "Pour Some Sugar On Me" but, I played the crap out of it back in the day, and truth be told, there are still a few tracks that I like quite a bit. Sigh... Too many good bands and not enough money to spend on albums. Saxon, Raven, Leppard, Scorpions and Maiden are bands that i want the whole discography from.