Why Does Metal Have the Most Loyal Fans?

krokus wrote:

Some of us are loyal but many have not been loyal to metal. Where are most of the people that follow metal in the 80s??? some stayed loyal (a couple of those guys are on this forum, you know who you are) but many many just listen to metal for some years and then gave up. Sad but true.

The guy who first helped get me into bands like Iron Maiden and Metallica was one of those. I remember reconnecting with him after I got out of college and we were talking about music and he told me, "Metal's dead, dude. Grunge killed it. IT'S OVER." He's a good guy but in retrospect he always was kind of a scenester.

sheets wrote:

krokus wrote:

Some of us are loyal but many have not been loyal to metal. Where are most of the people that follow metal in the 80s??? some stayed loyal (a couple of those guys are on this forum, you know who you are) but many many just listen to metal for some years and then gave up. Sad but true.

The guy who first helped get me into bands like Iron Maiden and Metallica was one of those. I remember reconnecting with him after I got out of college and we were talking about music and he told me, "Metal's dead, dude. Grunge killed it. IT'S OVER." He's a good guy but in retrospect he always was kind of a scenester.

Yes, those are the guys i was talking about. Some left our movement when grunge came out, some before, when glam metal was strong, some others after 1985 for exemple. Strange because ones they lived for metal, bought t-shirts, lps, tapes, magazines and then they were gone forever.

I am 53 and still, Metal is my favorite genre of music. I suppose at this point it is safe to say it always will be. But I strongly disagree with the premise of this thread. Metal does not have the most loyal fans. Metal has a small segment of the market. A few die hards.
Country music, which I don't care for, hands down has the most loyal fans. Thier industry is thriving in this tough economy. The fans are still buying the crap they are putting out and they don't generally down load.

All i can say is that metal is the most powerful style of music and the fans are hooked.

Let me venture slightly into the taboo here for a minute, bouncing off of a good point tink made...

Quite honestly, I always was sure that while reasons metal fans have for not downloading has to do with being so into the music, the reasons that country and rap fans buy more than download is..............well... general illiteracy. The ones pushing the sales through the roof aren't clever enough to download. That's my honest opinion. They're keeping their side of the industry thriving mostly by accident.

Orion Crystal Ice wrote:

Let me venture slightly into the taboo here for a minute, bouncing off of a good point tink made...

Quite honestly, I always was sure that while reasons metal fans have for not downloading has to do with being so into the music, the reasons that country and rap fans buy more than download is..............well... general illiteracy. The ones pushing the sales through the roof aren't clever enough to download. That's my honest opinion. They're keeping their side of the industry thriving mostly by accident.

i would dispute that, especially with country. I think the reasons a lot of us here still like cds is shared by those who buy country. I have several friends who cannot wait to go to best buy to when an album they want comes out. I asked them if they like iTunes and they all said the physical product with art, lyrics etc is more appealing to them.

I disagree as well. Sorry OCI. As a marketing geek, I have studied this thing a bit as a hobby. Country music fans are rabid. They love thier artists. The marketing behind country music is genious. They have things like Fanfest where the artsits spend time with the fans. The country fans would never steal music from thier favs. They work the crap out of radio. And guess what, they stick around after shows, sometimes for hours to make sure all the fans get what they want. In other words, they treat it like a business and take care of the customer.

I guess there might be more to the country thing then. Though in terms of the actual CD, that's a puzzling thing, because, as with most things within the pop realm...there really isn't any 'art' to savor, just typically a big blow up of the singer's face and more in the booklet. I still hold to my rap theory however, give me that one.

Orion Crystal Ice wrote:

.......... the reasons that country and rap fans buy more than download is..............well... general illiteracy. The ones pushing the sales through the roof aren't clever enough to download. That's my honest opinion. They're keeping their side of the industry thriving mostly by accident.

I never thought i'd have to bust this out but...........

Hey, I reconsidered the country one, you just can't make me reconsider the rap one. Think about it, is it not ironic yet somehow logical that many people glued to the filth that genre puts out, are so casual as 'music people', that to them the only way still, is to buy the CD, the way it's always been. That or the occasional iTunes as well. But the freakin shelves are CHOCK FULL of hip hop. CHOCK FULL. The music videos even still thrive, it's like nobody told them it's 2009. It's wonderful, like it's so backwards that it's forwards again.

rattpoison wrote:

Orion Crystal Ice wrote:

.......... the reasons that country and rap fans buy more than download is..............well... general illiteracy. The ones pushing the sales through the roof aren't clever enough to download. That's my honest opinion. They're keeping their side of the industry thriving mostly by accident.

I never thought i'd have to bust this out but...........

Also, as a rule, any posting of Trek directed towards me only summons a great swell of pride, regardless of content (unless content is comprised of most stills from Enterprise or Voyager).

Orion Crystal Ice wrote:

Hey, I reconsidered the country one, you just can't make me reconsider the rap one. Think about it, is it not ironic yet somehow logical that many people glued to the filth that genre puts out, are so casual as 'music people', that to them the only way still, is to buy the CD, the way it's always been. That or the occasional iTunes as well. But the freakin shelves are CHOCK FULL of hip hop. CHOCK FULL. The music videos even still thrive, it's like nobody told them it's 2009. It's wonderful, like it's so backwards that it's forwards again.

You seem to be talking about "Mainstream Hip Hop". Well your fan of "Mainstream Hip Hop" is probably your top 40 music fan, their young bought up in the digital age and therefore are quite capable of downloading say the latest T Pain ft. Whoever single.

Then there's your Hip Hop fan that's the equivalent of Metal fans on this board, fiercely independent music obsessives. The kinda people i'm elbowing while going through crates of dusty old 45's looking for that elusive 70's soul/funk gem at record fairs, the kinda people who own turntables and ridiculous sound systems, who buy almost exclusively vinyl, who may have infinite remixes of the same song, the people who trade mixtapes rabidly with others physically and digitally. There is this incredible hip hop community that thrives on participation and DIY ideals that mirrors exactly the Metal community that thrives on live shows, merchandise and collecting music.

Yep, definitely talking about the first one. I think the hip hop in the underground is a very respectable thing. I'm sort of partial to the 'nerdcore' movement though I'm not really a fan or anything. It's just hilarious to hear a rapper named MC Hawking rhyme about evolution.

Orion Crystal Ice wrote:

Yep, definitely talking about the first one.

I know you were but why talk about it in relation to a thread talking about music obsessives, it seemed the wrong comparison.

Your theory that illiteracy plays a role in keeping the mainstream end of Hip Hop thriving is the most ridiculous half baked theory i've ever heard. You were joking right?

I just severely doubt most of the people keeping things like crunk and all the sleazy, mainstream rap at the top of the charts, are doing so out of how their souls oh-so-love-and-need this rich music in it's purest form and all of that. It's because the majority of the target audience is uneducated youth who, while typically having access to a computer and the ABILITY to download, it just doesn't cross their mind the same way going out and getting a disc does, because that is truly what is left of the MTV revolution, the MTV generation, that's really the last big bastion left of 'how it used to be', and they follow suit, again, as I said, like this year and years past just never happened. Go buy the album and vote on the music video. Even though in most other markets, the idea of a music video is an utter waste of time and money, and people are being pressured to feel CD's are too. Yet these rappers and sensitive thug types go multi-platinum, stores full of copies, videos that look like they came right out of 1997, etc. The consumerism isn't about the art, and even if it were proposed it was, there *is no art*. I just think it's funny.

Metal is a perfect music. It requires lots of skills and musicianship. The music is so good you'd never get bored listening to it. I've had cds for over 15 years, and i still enjoy listening to them!

Metal is meant to crush everything and survive.

I'll always be faithful to metal.

Metal is similar to the Son of Hulk:


Which Hulk is the greatest there is?

Jeph Loeb:
It's ironic, but it's Banner who makes the Green Hulk the greatest. The idea of a man who was at the top of his field, had people who listened to him, was respected, and lost it all by sacrificing himself for another-Rick Jones-makes the monster all that more tragic. He lost everything. His job. The woman he loved. His family.While the Hulk has had many different personalities, they are all really different voices in Banner's head. The child, the angry teenager, the concerned adult-all of them. It makes him complex, even though sometimes he talks like he isn't and just smashes things. And sometimes complex is the most dangerous Hulk of all.

Jeff Parker: I call Skaar! And Skaar is easily the most metal of all Hulks. He slays dragons, he has an axe, and whenever faced with a dilemma, he will always make the most metal decision possible, like throwing Juggernaut off the planet or dooming billions to Galactus. He's like a UniMind composed of Ronnie James Dio, Ozzy, and all of Judas Priest.

bigjtink wrote:

I am 53 and still, Metal is my favorite genre of music. I suppose at this point it is safe to say it always will be. But I strongly disagree with the premise of this thread. Metal does not have the most loyal fans. Metal has a small segment of the market. A few die hards.
Country music, which I don't care for, hands down has the most loyal fans. Thier industry is thriving in this tough economy. The fans are still buying the crap they are putting out and they don't generally down load.

Hey Tink, I think we're getting tripped up on "most"...

Nobody is saying Metal has the "most" loyal fans (in terms of sheer numbers)...but the "most loyal" fans as in degree and depth of loyalty.

rattpoison wrote:

Orion Crystal Ice wrote:

.......... the reasons that country and rap fans buy more than download is..............well... general illiteracy. The ones pushing the sales through the roof aren't clever enough to download. That's my honest opinion. They're keeping their side of the industry thriving mostly by accident.

I never thought i'd have to bust this out but...........

Thats awesome! I smell a demotivational poster in this images future!

Orion Crystal Ice wrote:

I guess there might be more to the country thing then. Though in terms of the actual CD, that's a puzzling thing, because, as with most things within the pop realm...there really isn't any 'art' to savor, just typically a big blow up of the singer's face and more in the booklet. I still hold to my rap theory however, give me that one.

I won't give you the rap theory because all the guys who work in my warehouse who listen to rap don't buy the CD's...they bootleg them...they all have tons of burned CDR's in their cars and scanned booklets (a lot of "clothing stores" in my area sell bootleg CDs and DVDs)...the large majority of kids buying hip-hop, either CD or iTunes, are white kids...the same people buying all the other Pop.

rattpoison wrote:

Orion Crystal Ice wrote:

.......... the reasons that country and rap fans buy more than download is..............well... general illiteracy. The ones pushing the sales through the roof aren't clever enough to download. That's my honest opinion. They're keeping their side of the industry thriving mostly by accident.

I never thought i'd have to bust this out but...........

That statement is discriminatory and stereotypical on so many levels...

I agree Shawn, about "Most". And for OCI, Sales are not through the roof. I don't think illiteracy plays any role in this. I used to work with some guys who I considered marginally literate. They had Mp3 players.

I work with troubled boys and though many can hardly read and do basic level math they all know how to download illegaly. And rap is the genre of choice to rip off. I get all over them if I hear they rip off metal.

Shawn Of Fire wrote:

That statement is discriminatory and stereotypical on so many levels...

Nah. I live in the 'dirty south'. Gone to school with, worked with, networked with (local rap scene), everything you can think of except the job you have really - been involved in all of that and more with mainstream rap fans, who are literally everywhere. I know the difference between your normal everyday person with sense who listens and the person who chooses to act even less intelligent then whatever brain-raping track of their choice. It's an unfortunate thing but a big glut of the fans are the latter. Hey, I'm not saying metal fans are leading the free world in genius thought or action either. I'm just saying there's this red line that, whether people like it or not, unites otherwise separate events of: dumbed down rap music, poison culture, leading to: massive herd mentality, leading to: musical myopicism, leading to: stale thinking as a consumer, leading to: either not being aware of or just not caring about the point of view of everyone always nervously needing to 'push forward' and do things like get rid of CD's. Without even having to connect the dots, the numbers speak for themselves well enough. It's more interesting because some may argue the loyal metal fans share the stale thinking. I'm mapping out the way I believe we are at this same destination, but got there pretty differently.