Thrash drummers that can't quite keep up

So I've noticed this phenomenon for years now and never think to bring it up. Have you guys ever heard a super fast thrash song, an awesome one, loud and on the headphones, when suddenly you realize that the drummer is just a nickle behind and has to compensate for a beat here and there? This is especially true with snare work. Two examples would be Tom Hunting (Exodus) in Pleasures of the Flesh (Deranged is a messy affair the more I hear it) and some areas of Dark Angel's TDNH. Now, note, this is not a knock. I honestly could care less if the drummers are behind; if anything it adds to the chaotic studio nature of the genre. But it's a point of interest nonetheless. Let me know if you guys can think of anyone else.

The first one that came to mind was Possessed on "Seven Churches".

Lars sounds like he needed a ton of "polish" to play on the latest Metallica.

I've never noticed that on TDNH and heard it a million times. Where?

Temple of Blood wrote:

The first one that came to mind was Possessed on "Seven Churches".

Lars sounds like he needed a ton of "polish" to play on the latest Metallica.  

I've never noticed that on TDNH and heard it a million times.  Where?

I'll have to go back and check. I believe it first hit me while I was recently trying to learn Psychosexuality. Surprised me a bit as I was thinking, "damn Gene, keep up!" It's ever so slight.

Maaaan Seven Churches is a great "glorious mess" type of record. Good call.

At least, Dark Angel has those amazing "287 original riffs" to make up for it. If you've ever seen the original packaging, you'll get that joke.

Death - Primitive Ways was the first thing I thought of

I don’t agree with the TDNH comment. The album is super heavy, but not that fast... except for the last song “A Subtle Induction”. I think Gene played what was right for the album.

UNCLE SAXON'S KICKASS CDS wrote:

At least, Dark Angel has those amazing "287 original riffs" to make up for it.  If you've ever seen the original packaging, you'll get that joke.

Yeah I remember that, and thought it was dumb lol Wonder how many kids tried to count them to see if it was true.

Wrecked Neck wrote:

UNCLE SAXON'S KICKASS CDS wrote:

At least, Dark Angel has those amazing "287 original riffs" to make up for it.  If you've ever seen the original packaging, you'll get that joke.

Yeah I remember that, and thought it was dumb lol Wonder how many kids tried to count them to see if it was true.

It was 246. However, I remember one review on Metal Archives said, "I counted 247!"

There are rumors about Lars having some editing tricks done on "Dyers Eve". I honestly don't believe them, and think people want it to be true to make him look bad.

How about thrash albums with bad drum sound? Testaments Practice album has a horrible ticking sound.

Speaking of Testament...

I’m certain that if they didn’t slow down the tempo after The Legacy album, Louie Clemente would’ve definitely struggled to keep up. That guy wasn’t a true thrash drummer. The Ritual was more his pace.

I dunno, he was on the first five albums and they all had speedy songs on them until The Ritual.

Dark Horseman wrote:

I dunno, he was on the first five albums and they all had speedy songs on them until The Ritual.

Of coarse some other albums with Louie had some uptempo songs, but in general you can tell he really attacked the drums on The Legacy. After that, he gradually had less energy on each consecutive album until the great but basic style on The Ritual. Don’t get me wrong, I liked his playing, but I think Eric was held back by his limitations. He was more a traditional metal player as opposed to guys like Lombardo or Bostaph.

The story is that Lars had someone hold his cymbal to do the fast chokes on Dyer's Eve. I believe it.

I've seen Lars many times live and he's always struggling to keep up. He's beet-red with veins popping out in his neck and forehead. And they never seem to play many fast-tempo songs in a row. It's always a few fast ones, then something from ReLoad so Lars can catch his breath.

Temple of Blood wrote:

The story is that Lars had someone hold his cymbal to do the fast chokes on Dyer's Eve.  I believe it.

Has it ever been confirmed that some studio trickery was used on the drums during the recording of ...And Justice for All? I've heard all the rumors (and pretty much believe them) that takes were spliced and stuff, but has anyone substantiated it in a book or interview since then?

All kinds of modifications were used on AJFA. If they messed with Jason’s bass, I believe Lars also used studio tricks on his drums.

My guess is that he played it all on AJFA except those cymbal chokes.

I bet his newest album is the fakest drum-wise, because it is easier to cut/paste in the digital world these days than it was back then with analog tape.

Witchhunter is the king of drummers who can't quite keep up

Boris2008 wrote:

Witchhunter is the king of drummers who can't quite keep up

I think that album has all players holding on and then failing to keep up in turns It kinda evens all up!

Listening to those guitar solos, especially on Witching Metal, always makes me feel good because they sound exactly what I would be capable of playing and makes me feel like if they were able to make a record I would too!

Troublezone wrote:

All kinds of modifications were used on AJFA. If they messed with Jason’s bass, I believe Lars also used studio tricks on his drums.

Now that you mention it, I remember hearing Decrepit Birth did something like this on their debut album, ...And Time Begins, several years ago. I am not sure how much truth there is to that.