Is the EP overtaking the album?

I still prefer the sound of actually using a mic on a guitar cabinet, cranking it up and capturing the sound of the room instead of just running direct into the computer. Costs more but sounds more organic.

I also think drum tracks and bass tracks should be recorded with the musicians playing together in the studio instead of doing everything separate.

I prefer EPs to full length albums in most cases because most bands vomit forth 80 minutes of music, of which maybe 40 is quality. I prefer the EP format because it usually leaves me wanting some more from the band, rather than a turgid album that wastes the last 5 tracks. This is an area where vinyl was definitely superior to CD - the physical time limitation of vinyl led to more focused albums. The EP at least forces that same focus on the digital age.

S.D. wrote:

I still prefer the sound of actually using a mic on a guitar cabinet, cranking it up and capturing the sound of the room instead of just running direct into the computer. Costs more but sounds more organic.

We did this You got to have your individual tone captured, fans know you by your tone.


ToB: I actually would rather do the vocals at home if I had the means... well, if I had the means I would do a lot of things myself but I would still bring in an engineer I trusted. None of us are really in a situation where we can pool money to the quality needed to set up something worthy of more than bedroom band status, so we did it old school and worked on the clock and learned a ton, which is priceless.

This doesn't bother me whatsoever. The extreme scene has always been about EP's, Splits, & 7 inch releases. I certainly don't mind when the more mainstream bands fall in line. The releases usually come at a faster rate of speed.

Witchfinder wrote:

in most cases because most bands vomit forth 80 minutes of music, of which maybe 40 is quality. I prefer the EP format because it usually leaves me wanting some more from the band, rather than a turgid album that wastes the last 5 tracks.

See?

Shawn Of Fire wrote:

Witchfinder wrote:

in most cases because most bands vomit forth 80 minutes of music, of which maybe 40 is quality. I prefer the EP format because it usually leaves me wanting some more from the band, rather than a turgid album that wastes the last 5 tracks.

See?

In cases like this, I'm not a fan of the band if I don't like half the music.

Exactly. See, the metal scene is so great because there are so few rewards in a lot of cases beyond just fulfilling your artistry and sharing it, so the incentive for so many bands is to have the best record and best songs as they possibly can. Call it the market fixing itself.

There's 90,000 metal bands. Some of them are gonna have crap, and sometimes your tastes might be crap too. But there is really a lot of great music out there.

Believe me when I say this music and everything about this music and everyone having to do with this music is too much of a pain in the ass to deal with to just make a bad record. When you make a bad record, you're (a. just starting out, or (b. not working hard enough.

Orion Crystal Ice wrote:

When you make a bad record, you're (a. just starting out, or (b. not working hard enough.

c.) not very good and shouldn't record anything in the first place.

what annoys me is that a lot of the EPs are longer because of live tracks.

exact33 wrote:

what annoys me is that a lot of the EPs are longer because of live tracks.

Back in the 80s the EPs I usually bought were a conglomeration of stuff. A new song, b-sides, a couple live tracks, etc. That was the material I expected to be on an EP.

The only EPs I've bought over the last several years were a couple that Porcupine Tree released (Futile and Nil Recurring), in both cases they recorded more material during the sessions than they wanted on the official album so they released them separately.

I rarely buy them but it really depends on what the material is.

S.D. wrote:

exact33 wrote:

what annoys me is that a lot of the EPs are longer because of live tracks.

Back in the 80s the EPs I usually bought were a conglomeration of stuff. A new song, b-sides, a couple live tracks, etc. That was the material I expected to be on an EP.

That's what I was getting at about putting this kind of stuff as "bonus material" on an album. The album just needs to be the album...the bonus stuff belongs on an EP.

Shawn Of Fire wrote:

S.D. wrote:

exact33 wrote:

what annoys me is that a lot of the EPs are longer because of live tracks.

Back in the 80s the EPs I usually bought were a conglomeration of stuff. A new song, b-sides, a couple live tracks, etc. That was the material I expected to be on an EP.

That's what I was getting at about putting this kind of stuff as "bonus material" on an album. The album just needs to be the album...the bonus stuff belongs on an EP.

100% agree, when they re-issue an album with bonus tracks, that are just live tracks, they need to reissue those tunes, B sides, live stuff as an EP, for peps like me who refuse to rebuy the same damn album.

Butr Shawn is right the music industry has changed and I think this is one way the industry is trying to save itself, I doubt it will work.

one of the funny things about the EP is that the EP is usually the thing which is all filler or who cares live tracks, not the album....there are exceptions, but usually..

I think there are many great metal albums but very, very few great metal EPs.

manny wrote:

Shawn Of Fire wrote:

S.D. wrote:

exact33 wrote:

what annoys me is that a lot of the EPs are longer because of live tracks.

Back in the 80s the EPs I usually bought were a conglomeration of stuff. A new song, b-sides, a couple live tracks, etc. That was the material I expected to be on an EP.

That's what I was getting at about putting this kind of stuff as "bonus material" on an album. The album just needs to be the album...the bonus stuff belongs on an EP.

100% agree, when they re-issue an album with bonus tracks, that are just live tracks, they need to reissue those tunes, B sides, live stuff as an EP, for peps like me who refuse to rebuy the same damn album.

Butr Shawn is right the music industry has changed and I think this is one way the industry is trying to save itself, I doubt it will work.

I see the point. Why buy the re-issue for the bonus tracks. As far as the music industry saving itself, I have no ideas.

I myself am getting sick of seeing reissue after reissue, especially with all the double dipping involved (still undecided with the new 2112). I would love to see companion EPs that pair with the original album to enhance the listening experience of something already familiar. Do these more as time goes on at a reduced price; I'll take em.

I see EPs as the future for independent or small label artists. It'll save on all production costs except for pressing & art, AND could allow for, in theory, faster turn around for new music from these bands (an EP per year/18 months instead of an album every 3 to 4 years).

If new bands put their 4 or 5 best songs together, put them out, do shows and let people really get to know those few songs before putting out more, it could, again in theory, provide some longevity.

I can tell you from my perspective, I'd love to do EPs in the future and get them out quicker, charge less for them, and be really happy with all the songs on a given release.

My main gripe with eps is the length (that's what she said).

As someone that still listens to actual cds, I generally won't pull an ep from the shelf becasue I don't want to swap it out after 4 or 5 songs. I'd rather have an albums worth of tunes playing while I work.

It's not an issue if I'm loading it on my mp3 player with other music, but that's rare.

As I mentioned, not usually a fan of EP's, but this one (available on download only) is pretty cool and worth purchasing for $3.96:

http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00CDU5UMI/ref=cm_cr_mts_prod_img




Full Disclosure: this is my Brother's band (he is the singer)

MetalGuy71 wrote:

My main gripe with eps is the length (that's what she said).

As someone that still listens to actual cds, I generally won't pull an ep from the shelf becasue I don't want to swap it out after 4 or 5 songs. I'd rather have an albums worth of tunes playing while I work.

It's not an issue if I'm loading it on my mp3 player with other music, but that's rare.

And that is just it. Todays generation couldn't give a rats ass about full albums, the create playlists on Spotify instead. Artists mainly sell single songs on iTunes. Thus, I believe the market for albums will slowly pass, and EP' will be the new albums.

The Newstedt EP is a great example of how I see the future. More tours, fewer songs...

My problem is I'm not one for just doing something because a bunch of people bumble around and randomly decide how things are gonna be at any given time. I want to make nothing but albums and probably listen to nothing but albums too.

kmorg wrote:

The Newstedt EP is a great example of how I see the future. More tours, fewer songs...

I agree 100%...

kmorg wrote:

MetalGuy71 wrote:

My main gripe with eps is the length (that's what she said).

As someone that still listens to actual cds, I generally won't pull an ep from the shelf becasue I don't want to swap it out after 4 or 5 songs. I'd rather have an albums worth of tunes playing while I work.

It's not an issue if I'm loading it on my mp3 player with other music, but that's rare.

And that is just it. Todays generation couldn't give a rats ass about full albums, the create playlists on Spotify instead. Artists mainly sell single songs on iTunes. Thus, I believe the market for albums will slowly pass, and EP' will be the new albums.

The Newstedt EP is a great example of how I see the future. More tours, fewer songs...

It's all cyclical. Rock n roll of the 50's and early 60's was all based on selling the single. Then as artists starting making full albums of rock, the market turned to full LP sales in the 70's. In the 80's, singles were marketed again. It was the decade of the "one-hit wonder". The 90's saw artists, not wanting to fall into that one-hit-wonder category, concentrate on full albums again. While the 00's gave us the ability to cherry-pick the best, I believe it will come around again full-circle. Might be awhile, sure, but history has a way of repeating itself.

MetalGuy71 wrote:

kmorg wrote:

MetalGuy71 wrote:

My main gripe with eps is the length (that's what she said).

As someone that still listens to actual cds, I generally won't pull an ep from the shelf becasue I don't want to swap it out after 4 or 5 songs. I'd rather have an albums worth of tunes playing while I work.

It's not an issue if I'm loading it on my mp3 player with other music, but that's rare.

And that is just it. Todays generation couldn't give a rats ass about full albums, the create playlists on Spotify instead. Artists mainly sell single songs on iTunes. Thus, I believe the market for albums will slowly pass, and EP' will be the new albums.

The Newstedt EP is a great example of how I see the future. More tours, fewer songs...

It's all cyclical. Rock n roll of the 50's and early 60's was all based on selling the single. Then as artists starting making full albums of rock, the market turned to full LP sales in the 70's. In the 80's, singles were marketed again. It was the decade of the "one-hit wonder". The 90's saw artists, not wanting to fall into that one-hit-wonder category, concentrate on full albums again. While the 00's gave us the ability to cherry-pick the best, I believe it will come around again full-circle. Might be awhile, sure, but history has a way of repeating itself.

You're right about the cycles.

I recall something about Peter Frampton's 'Frampton Comes Alive' being the point in the 70s when it started slowly becoming about singles selling the albums. When "Do You Feel Like I Do" took off and that live album sold umpteen million copies, labels went "Hm...we can just push one song and sell that much??"...so then it became about the single ON the album...then the people (in general) started with "there's only 1 good song on the album"...then over time, options opened up to get the single without having to buy the album (internet) ad now we are where we are.