I was just wondering..... (Part Deux)

I am pro choice, and I believe that abortion should remain legal and safe and I also wish it would happen rarely. I am personally not a big fan of abortions and I would judge or look down on anyone who has had to make that decision or chosen to make that decision, and I am not sure if it is a choice I could make but I feel that it should remain legal.

I think abortion should remain a "choice" until a physician determines that the fetus is viable outside the womb.

After that, unless there are extenuating circumstances like rape, I'm anti-abortion.

akeldama wrote:

Pro-life, IMO Satan has always tried to kill babies. Since the days of Exodus to today.

What about God killing the first born pharoh's son (queue up Creeping Death now!)

My opinion - it is taking a life. When an abortion is performed, a life is taken.

That said, I don't think early term abortions be illegal - I believe that God allows us to make choices, right or wrong. I believe God gave us free will. He lets us make our own choices, if not you can not be responsible for your own sin (I am in no way, shape or form a reformed/calvinist type).

I do, however believe that partial birth and late term abortions should be illegal - I just think it's crazy that someone would do that!

I also think the millitant pro-choice crowd are nuts - they are just as fanitical as the blow up the clinic crowd (I;m not a fan of that crowd either!). They think that making any abortion illegal is somehow "taking away their rights" - I'm sorry, if a baby can survive outside of the womb, it's murder.

The other thing is that abortions are big business - there is money out there to be had. The abortion doctors are very happy that they now have federal money coming in to pay for the procedures.

The whole issue isn't just about life vs rights, there is so much more behind it.

SAXON1500 wrote:

Eyesore wrote:

I could have been a father at 16. Meaning I'd have a kid about to enter college right now. There's no way having a kid at that age would have been a good thing, for anyone. Thus, I am pro-choice.

It's crazy to think about, you know. How would my life be now if we didn't do that. I can't answer that question, of course; just like back then I couldn't answer the question of my own life. Things were not good for me back then. Some days I'm amazed I'm alive, you know. And I didn't struggle with drugs and alcohol. But life was not good, and it wouldn't have been right to bring a child into this world.

You sell yourself short. 16 yr olds have been living with that "mistake" for 1000's of years. Many of the greatest humans ever came from that exact situation. I am not saying your personal decision is going to send you to hell, but, at least in retroSPECt, you know that would have been a pretty cool kid, and it would not have killed you to raise it. If you want to talk about evolution, talk about the evolution/adaptation of Eyesore. Not much difference.

It was more than just the age and my situation. It was my girlfriend's family. In fact, they were probably the heaviest hand in that situation and they never even knew. I started dating this girl when I was 16. She was a year younger. When I turned 18--the day I turned 18, for that matter--they sat me down and told me if they ever found out we were having sex, they'd have me arrested for statutory rape. And they would have. And if they found out she was pregnant, they would literally shut me out forever. I have no doubt in my mind, even back then I knew.

This girl is my best friend. When she turned 30, I had started to plan a big birthday bash for her. I got with her sisters and friends and suggested we rent a gym. She plays volleyball multiple times a week, so we were going to rent a gym like the YMCA, where there was a court and a rec center. That way family and volleyball players alike could celebrate. Her family found out I was involved and literally lied to me and said they would plan something instead at their house, something were friends and family could go. Then they shut me off. Finally, after numerous phone calls and e-mails, they replied and said "We're just going to go with the original plan and go out to dinner Friday night." I had planned a Saturday celebration. They dropped this on me on the Wednesday before. And her 30th birthday consisted of about 10 family members, including kids and her grandmother.

It's been like 17 years since we first dated, and I have done nothing but love that girl ever since. Not good enough for them. Even now, I'm still not good enough. I'm the kid with the f*cked up family, the poor family, the kid that has no ambition to become a lawyer or a doctor. If we had had that baby, they would still be fighting me tooth and nail.

I knew this thread was spec making light of the other controversial thread but I guess I will say what I think.

I believe God despises all killing. Abortion is murder.

Stender wrote:

I believe God despises all killing.

Dude: Holy crap, a spider!
*squish*
God: WHAT THE F*CK, MAN?!?

Stender wrote:

I knew this thread was spec making light of the other controversial thread but I guess I will say what I think.

I believe God despises all killing. Abortion is murder.

Next time you kill a spider, better go to church and beg for forgiveness.

To put it in a very blunt way, a fetus is essentially a parasite.

Schbopo wrote:

Stender wrote:

I believe God despises all killing.

Dude: Holy crap, a spider!
*squish*
God: WHAT THE F*CK, MAN?!?

It's a sad day at the HoM Corral when me and Schpoopoo are on the same page.

Eyesore wrote:

Stender wrote:

I knew this thread was spec making light of the other controversial thread but I guess I will say what I think.

I believe God despises all killing. Abortion is murder.

Next time you kill a spider, better go to church and beg for forgiveness.

To put it in a very blunt way, a fetus is essentially a parasite.

Yep exactly the same as a parasite....except a fetus turns into a human being later.

my wife had one years ago. after that i got my vasectomy. we see nothing morally wrong with it, but no sense in doing it twice.

Eyesore wrote:

Schbopo wrote:

Stender wrote:

I believe God despises all killing.

Dude: Holy crap, a spider!
*squish*
God: WHAT THE F*CK, MAN?!?

It's a sad day at the HoM Corral when me and Schpoopoo are on the same page.

I guess you are saying Schlopopo is beneath you? Step up and explain just what you meant there.

Stender wrote:

Eyesore wrote:

Stender wrote:

I knew this thread was spec making light of the other controversial thread but I guess I will say what I think.

I believe God despises all killing. Abortion is murder.

Next time you kill a spider, better go to church and beg for forgiveness.

To put it in a very blunt way, a fetus is essentially a parasite.

Yep exactly the same as a parasite....except a fetus turns into a human being later.

Later. Much later. Until then, it is not a human being. Sounds harsh, but it's like calling a maggot a fly.

And just before this gets out of hand, I am sensitive about this subject. People ignorantly throwing out the word murderer will do that. So try to temper your words. Abortion is not murder. Killing the woman would be. Nothing else is.

SAXON1500 wrote:

Eyesore wrote:

Schbopo wrote:

Stender wrote:

I believe God despises all killing.

Dude: Holy crap, a spider!
*squish*
God: WHAT THE F*CK, MAN?!?

It's a sad day at the HoM Corral when me and Schpoopoo are on the same page.

I guess you are saying Schlopopo is beneath you? Step up and explain just what you meant there.

Huh? I was referring to the "God despises all killing" comment. If Stender is vegan who doesn't kill bugs, then he's cool. Otherwise, meh.

Eyesore wrote:

And just before this gets out of hand, I am sensitive about this subject. People ignorantly throwing out the word murderer will do that. So try to temper your words. Abortion is not murder. Killing the woman would be. Nothing else is.

As long as you acknowledge that that is your opinion and not rock-solid fact that we all must live by.

And I have sympathy for whatever your situation may be.

SAXON1500 wrote:

Eyesore wrote:

And just before this gets out of hand, I am sensitive about this subject. People ignorantly throwing out the word murderer will do that. So try to temper your words. Abortion is not murder. Killing the woman would be. Nothing else is.

As long as you acknowledge that that is your opinion and not rock-solid fact that we all must live by.

And I have sympathy for whatever your situation may be.

Of course it is. And a big part of is probably me justifying the choice we made. I truly believe we made the right choice, and it sure as hell wasn't easy, but it was the right decision. I don't think I could ever look back and say otherwise, even if deep down I felt that way, you know.

But yeah, it's my opinion. I stand by it, and I'll defend it, but not a single thing I say on this forum, or anywhere, for that matter, is meant to be law. I respect everyone's opinion, or at least their right to it.

Eyesore wrote:

Stender wrote:

Eyesore wrote:

Stender wrote:

I knew this thread was spec making light of the other controversial thread but I guess I will say what I think.

I believe God despises all killing. Abortion is murder.

Next time you kill a spider, better go to church and beg for forgiveness.

To put it in a very blunt way, a fetus is essentially a parasite.

Yep exactly the same as a parasite....except a fetus turns into a human being later.

Later. Much later. Until then, it is not a human being. Sounds harsh, but it's like calling a maggot a fly.

And just before this gets out of hand, I am sensitive about this subject. People ignorantly throwing out the word murderer will do that. So try to temper your words. Abortion is not murder. Killing the woman would be. Nothing else is.

Just so you know if you dont already, that post was pure sarcasm..no way do I liken a fetus to a parasite. Fetus and human being should be exchangeable words IMO.

I don't have any moral qualms about abortion, so I am pro-choice. It's not a great thing, but really, it is necessary to have a safe and legal outlet for it. Otherwise, either there'd be illegal abortions, where the health risks would be insurmountable, or an increase in abandoned children - really, neither of those is a great outcome.

I have no problem with people being "pro-life", however I do take issue with the 'aborter' being referred to as a murderer. I just don't think it's the same; it's potential for life, not life yet. Surely, if it's considered murder, it stands to reason that there should be legal repercussions for abortion? The issue with making something like abortion illegal is the fact that you then have to punish those who commit it. And if you class it as murder, the punishment is going to be pretty harsh.

I'm against abortion in general but one thing bugs me... What if the woman is raped? Should she have to live with the fact that she brought the rapist's child into the world? I believe abortion/murder is extremely wrong but the rape thing bothers me at the same time.

thejokeriv wrote:

akeldama wrote:

Pro-life, IMO Satan has always tried to kill babies. Since the days of Exodus to today.

What about God killing the first born pharoh's son (queue up Creeping Death now!)

My opinion - it is taking a life. When an abortion is performed, a life is taken.

That said, I don't think early term abortions be illegal - I believe that God allows us to make choices, right or wrong. I believe God gave us free will. He lets us make our own choices, if not you can not be responsible for your own sin (I am in no way, shape or form a reformed/calvinist type).

I do, however believe that partial birth and late term abortions should be illegal - I just think it's crazy that someone would do that!

I also think the millitant pro-choice crowd are nuts - they are just as fanitical as the blow up the clinic crowd (I;m not a fan of that crowd either!). They think that making any abortion illegal is somehow "taking away their rights" - I'm sorry, if a baby can survive outside of the womb, it's murder.

The other thing is that abortions are big business - there is money out there to be had. The abortion doctors are very happy that they now have federal money coming in to pay for the procedures.

The whole issue isn't just about life vs rights, there is so much more behind it.

Very good point but that's a complex situation. Before Christ was born Satan was always trying to corrupt the bloodline of Jesus. But I'm not here to preach so I'll leave it at that. I agree though that God gives us free will. You have good points on all the aforementioned scenarios.

Eyesore wrote:

But yeah, it's my opinion. I stand by it, and I'll defend it, but not a single thing I say on this forum, or anywhere, for that matter, is meant to be law. I respect everyone's opinion, or at least their right to it.

that's the best thing anyone can do eyesore, thumbs up for you.

Most peole that are against abortion have never been in a situation where they seriously had to take a stance.

For some reason, i avoided posting my opinion, but here we go.

I tend to believe it is wrong - Not the dicitonary term of "murder", but I look at it in a different way. First of all, I must state, that unless you are fertilised against your will, you must take responsibility for your actions.

As for the murder thing - No, it can feel no pain, and it's not a human being yet - Just like a bowl of flour, yeast and water ain't bread. But you must understand, that you are gambling with one truly unique person - Most people tend to forget the fact that this person will never be born again - Sure, you can get pregnant and have a child 7 years later, but that will be a completely different person, regardless if it is the same fsther or not. I believe you should do anything to give this baby (or future baby) a chance. So, if you cannot take care of it, or want nothing to do with it, at least try and maybe set it up for adoption or something. And yes I know, that is highly controversial as well and hard for those parents who would want to keep their child if it's born, but I am sick of hearing the same teenage blonde girl argument, "do you really want him to grow up in a world never knowing his biological parents? Have you any idea of how traumatizing that is for a person?" - Seriously, if your kid was adopted, and you sat him down twenty years later and talked to him/her, I think that person would be very happy that he/she got to live, instead of being erased from all existence.

What I am saying, is give this human being a chance - Like we all get. Again, this baby will never be born again. Most people forget about that. If you start investing in a huge construction project, you finish it. Same here, if you start the process of life, you must step up and take the consequence. Abortion is highly unfair.

I know it is hard in situations like Eyesore's, but I still believe that any human being should get a chance.

By the way, what is the legal age for sexual intercourse in America? In Denmark, it is 15 years, so in that case Ken could not be charged for any crime. And Ken, can those parents even start anything, if your girlfriend had admitted to be fully willing and did not feel violated in any way?. I assume you were both underage when you had sex?

Ken, think about if you and your girlfriend had actually gone through with the birth - Would it not have been all worth it today? - Screw her parents, they have no say in this matter. Surely they would have continued to bother you for years, but experiencing your kid grow up, his first day of school, watching him grow as a person, have your first father-son beer together - Would it not have been all worth it? - I'm sure your child would have been very grateful.

I am not looking down on you for your decision at all, it truly is hard in that age and situation, I am just curious to know.

Those were just my two cents

Mglaffas

Mglaffas81 wrote:

By the way, what is the legal age for sexual intercourse in America?

There really isn't one.

Schbopo wrote:

Mglaffas81 wrote:

By the way, what is the legal age for sexual intercourse in America?

There really isn't one.

Well there must be something - For example, in Denmark, if you both are under the age of 15, you are allowed to have sex with each other - Same if you are both over. But you can't be 18 and have sex with a 14 year-old.

Mglaffas81 wrote:

Well there must be something - For example, in Denmark, if you both are under the age of 15, you are allowed to have sex with each other - Same if you are both over. But you can't be 18 and have sex with a 14 year-old.

Ohhhhhhhh. Yeah.

It's 18.