Wanted, recommendations of Christian metal bands that sound like..

Just realized I didn't read anybody suggesting Antithesis or Oil. Real power metal, emphasis on the word "power".

ANTITHESIS are a great band! One of the very best Christian bands.

Yes, I was a huge fan of all The Crucified's material.
Their manager Tim Anderson kept in contact with me by mail and phone, and i forgot about talking to the band members. Tim was very cool.

Been lagging in ordering the Crucified boxset with the dvd.

When the initial big wave of Christian Thrash happened, I was into it. Slowly listened to less secular music for a few years

I had a dubbed copy of Vengeance's demo and bought their albums when released (*I wished I grabbed the vinyl immediately before the name changed, adding the Rising).

I liked Deliverance and Tourniquet, but not that much back then.

Also loved Believer's first 2 albums, X-SINNER's "Get it", One Bad Pig, Petra "Come and Join Us", The Lead "Burn This Record", Sacrament and Living Sacrifice's debut's.
and for awhile Dale Early's Tempered Steel radio show (I should have sent money to stay on the mailing list for tapes).
That show introduced me to LightForce's demo and I was blown away, so I liked Mortification's debut a lot.

Around 1991 or 92, I found a Christian bookstore that sold tapes and cd's, I think I bought Heaven's Metal there maybe, but I made the mistake one day of telling friends at a Napalm Death/Sepultura concert down the street from it .

I pulled out Sacrament's Testimony cd, they said Hey that looks pretty heavy,I said it was Christian , then someone I knew in the scene into black metal, and kicking over gravestones and stuff, I suspect overheard me talking about the store and went there and was stealing from them.
They stopped carrying metal and any good hard rock after awhile.

Yes,Place of Skulls is exactly what I was looking for! I'll be ordering the newest one!

mlotek wrote:

Yes, I was a huge fan of all The Crucified's material.
Their manager Tim Anderson kept in contact with me by mail and phone, and i forgot about talking to the band members. Tim was very cool.

Been lagging in ordering the Crucified boxset with the dvd.

When the initial big wave of Christian Thrash happened, I was into it. Slowly listened to less secular music for a few years

I had a dubbed copy of Vengeance's demo and bought their albums when released (*I wished I grabbed the vinyl immediately before the name changed, adding the Rising).

I liked Deliverance and Tourniquet, but not that much back then.

Also loved Believer's first 2 albums, X-SINNER's "Get it", One Bad Pig, Petra "Come and Join Us", The Lead "Burn This Record", Sacrament and Living Sacrifice's debut's.
and for awhile Dale Early's Tempered Steel radio show (I should have sent money to stay on the mailing list for tapes).
That show introduced me to LightForce's demo and I was blown away, so I liked Mortification's debut a lot.

Around 1991 or 92, I found a Christian bookstore that sold tapes and cd's, I think I bought Heaven's Metal there maybe, but I made the mistake one day of telling friends at a Napalm Death/Sepultura concert down the street from it .

I pulled out Sacrament's Testimony cd, they said Hey that looks pretty heavy,I said it was Christian , then someone I knew in the scene into black metal, and kicking over gravestones and stuff, I suspect overheard me talking about the store and went there and was stealing from them.
They stopped carrying metal and any good hard rock after awhile.

Dude, that stinks leave it to one bad apple to spoil the whole barrel.

Tell me!
It took me a bunch of phone calls to learn initially it was the only store in Toronto had that music in stock, the other Christian bookstores didn't , and they were a hassle to travel to check their shelves (would take like two hours by public transit to get there).

You guys got me reliving memories here. Driving around town to all the Christian Bookstores in the early '90s to listen to cassette demos and purchase albums. At the time I was into bands like WhiteCross, Bride, Petra, Guardian and White Heart. I was always on the lookout for an album by them that I didn't have.

I discovered bands like Living Sacrifice, the Brave, Tourniquet, Deliverance, Mortification and Holy Soldier by checking out demos. At the time, I would grab a demo just because I dug the artwork on it. There were a couple of albums I purchased just because I liked the album Art.

Ah the memories...

ryanmetalman wrote:

There were a couple of albums I purchased just because I liked the album Art.

I stole a tape of Mortification-s/t from Wal-Mart when I was 16 because of that! Of course I had no idea they were Christian, quite the irony there.

DallasBlack wrote:

ryanmetalman wrote:

There were a couple of albums I purchased just because I liked the album Art.

I stole a tape of Mortification-s/t from Wal-Mart when I was 16 because of that! Of course I had no idea they were Christian, quite the irony there.

I swiped the first Deliverance album as a kid from a Christian bookstore. When I first met Jimmy P. Brown II years and years later, I actually offered him the money for the tape and he wouldn't take it.


Btw...while I haven't actively listened to any "Christian" metal since about 1997 (minus a few exceptions that found me as a music journalist, like Extol, Becoming The Archetype, Rob Rock, etc.), I did go out of my way to track down The Crucified boxset. WOW...the remastering job on Pillars Of Humanity is worth the price of admission on its own. Seriously...it's so loud and crisp now, with every single instrument at the fore. AMAZING. And the complete remix of the two post-Pillars demos make the tracks as sharp and vibrant as if they were legitimately culled from a long-lost 3rd LP. I was seriously impressed. To make a grizzled agnostic like myself thrash around to a song called "Power Of God," you know it's f'ing top shelf.

I'd like to see someone remaster that first Die Happy, now, and maybe the Sacrament records...


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Quote :

I'd like to see someone remaster that first Die Happy

Please, oh please.

Ha...I was listening to the debut not that long ago. I know I'm not supposed to like/approve of the Die Happy stuff, since Roger is my friend and so forth, but a.) good music is good music and b.) those guys have been nothing but good friends to me as well, and showed me a lot of genuine comradery when they didn't really have to. But yeah...I'd snap a reissue up in a heartbeat. Hell, I'd volunteer to write the liners. I probably won't mention it to Rog, though


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One, it needs to be rereleased as it's hard to find and two, remastering would give it more life. It's good but flat.
I keep hoping Rog and the VR guys get things worked out.

TheNazgul wrote:

One, it needs to be rereleased as it's hard to find and two, remastering would give it more life. It's good but flat.
I keep hoping Rog and the VR guys get things worked out.

I didn't realize how low and muddy the audio levels were until I listened to it (oddly enough) back to back with the recent Crucified remaster. And the bootleg burn of the debut that's floating around the internet is terrible. Only 128kb, with pops.

I doubt things will ever work out between Roger and those guys. I can speak with some authority on this; I spent the better part of five years trying to play diplomat when I ran Roger's message board and worked as his publicist. I have some great stories, though

Rog has calmed down a bit the last year or so, concentrating mostly on his real estate career. I don't think he's recorded any music in a while. I used to send him CD's of "current" bands for him to check out so he could keep up whenever he finally decided to get up off his ass, but little ever came of it. (I tried really hard to make him an At The Gates and Behemoth fan for some reason; I'm not terribly sure why, in retrospect, apart from that those bands are awesome, and it crushed my spirit when he told me he was listening to Disturbed. *sigh* I also tried to get him into Arch Enemy, but he never had much to say about the music, apart from that he'd like to pork Angela Gossow.)

Anyway, SOMEWHERE, there are two "lost" Vengeance Rising recordings.

1. Realms Of Blasphemy was mostly recorded, in bits and pieces, and just needs to be cobbled together and finished. It was rotting in his storage bin last we'd talked. He seemed more intent on re-recording that stuff, even though I think it's a little dated (it's very Deicide). It couldn't be released as an album, but could probably be released in a demos and B-sides collection, a la Mercyful Fate's Return Of The Vampire. (Sorry--I'm on a kick with them right now...) I don't know if the "Smoke Those mother goose" single/EP was ever recorded; I don't think Roger actually remembers either; again, his storage locker of doom...

2. He recorded an EP with a largely unknown line-up in 2005 called Send Me Your Money. It included a cover of the Suicidal Tendencies song of the same name. I can, in fact, verify that this was indeed recorded. Roger also laid down a couple of newer cuts and (if memory serves me) a cover of Venom's "Witching Hour" and a new version of "You Can't Stop It."

It's been a really long time, and I don't entirely recall what the gameplan was anymore. All I know is that this line-up disbanded pretty quickly, and that the studio kept the recordings because they were never fully paid. Roger was unhappy with the sessions, and wanted to re-record "Send Me Your Money" with ST's Mike Muir actually doing back-ups (trivia tidbit: the two were close friends at one point, so this almost could have happened).

Other tidbits (that I remember):

3. At some point, he announced that he was re-recording Human Sacrifice with different lyrics. I am pleased to take credit for talking him out of this.

4. Circa 2006, we decided he was going to do a show, just so we could record it and get something out there to hold people over. I basically put the line-up together for him out of friends' bands. Of that group, only Mike Francisco managed to be considered a "real" band member, that Roger intended on recording with. The show fell apart, but it actually wasn't Roger's fault that time--we got dicked over by the venue.

5. Later, he anounced that he was going to do an EP of covers. In addition to the Suicidal Tendencies and Venom covers, he wanted to do Bathory's "Shores In Flames" (seriously!), Exodus' "Bonded By Blood," and some other stuff I don't recall. The tentative title was the Sacrifice Of Cain EP. The fans didn't want it--after a nearly 15-year wait, they naturally wanted new original VR stuff. The EP was scrapped. Nothing was ever recorded for it.

6. He finally anounced a new full-length to be called POLEMIC. I jokingly called it Chinese Blasphemy, since it was taking him so long.
The line-up would have included Brian Khairullah (bass), Michael Francisco (guitar), "Simon Dawg" (guest guitar), and a guy named Daniel Faulk on drums (whom I never met). Also, Gary Lenaire had expressed some interest in donating a solo or two, but did not wish to become a full member, though I recall that Roger invited him to join. I don't know what ever happened with this. Even *I* finally gave up hope on it. Maybe it'll happen someday--I know Brian and Mike are still down to do it. Otherwise...yeah... *shrug* *sigh*


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Very enlighteming Stig...thanks!

I would be all over a Die Happy remaster in a heartbeat, the Crucified stuff came out awesome.

I would imagine that Intense Millennium will get around to re-doing that first Die Happy disc sooner or later...

Fat Freddy wrote:

I would imagine that Intense Millennium will get around to re-doing that first Die Happy disc sooner or later...

Woo Hoo!!!

So again, I have to ask the unpopular question (because I'm thrilled to see Roger's music available to the masses once more): How did Human Sacrifice get reissued (with the logo smurfing redesigned, no less!) without any of us being even gently nudged or notified? Who is getting the royalties? Roger Martinez did not simply assume the rights to the debt of VR--he assumed the NAME and THE RIGHTS. We couldn't make the reissues work on our own, because a.) the old label had restructured several times and had no idea where the original contracts were at the time (or at least wanted me to believe this), and b.) Roger could not find his copy, either. No contracts, no "100% legal" reissue. The name "Vengeance Rising" is a copyright of Roger Martinez. He IS Vengeance Rising. And he co-wrote that album; who is getting paid for it? I doubt Doug or Larry are getting anything, either.

Roger would not have authorized this reissue. Even though we don't communicate like we used to, he would have shot me an e-mail over this. Why? Because there's money involved...and also, he had very specific conditions before he agreed to let us try to do it. Roger and I agreed as far back as 2005 that we were going to put the albums back out with comprehensive liner notes, photos, etc., and print T-shirts with the debut album artwork. Even as his publicist and friend, I had to BEG him to even consider this--he's ashamed of everything he did as a Christian artist, and it took a LOT of convincing to persuade him that reissues and T-shirts would be a good idea if he was going to record new music.

And I know it's petty, but I can't help but think how much Roger would smurf poo bricks over them altering his band logo. If this is legit, I'm at a loss.

I guess it sounds like I'm being butthurt about this, and I'm not really--I'm just curious how this happened without any of the creative parties involved, especially after all we went through to get as far we did (only to flounder like some majestic...um...floundering thing).

Oh well. At least the music lives, no?


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Thanks STIGMATADOR for all the VR info.
Whatever Roger Martinez releases, might not be as huge due to :
1) many of the original fans were Christian and will guess he will have lyrics to purposely offend them
2) too many people download, never buying


I have put off buying those re-issues, would like to know exactly if the band memebrs are getting royalties, etc

Dave Carlo of RAZOR has complianed for years he has gotten nothing for the early LP's that were pressed onto to CD by Unidisc who got the rights from ATTIC records, but now a re-release CD of Executioner's Song on Unidisc appeared recently,and I'm not hearing any complaints, and rumour is, Carlo no longer cares as he makes more money being a music producer for tv/radio commercials.

Ordering that Crucified re-release, glad it's better and not just a repackage.

Did you just say Simon Dawg? Would that by Mr. Jimmy Brown?

STIGMATADOR wrote:

So again, I have to ask the unpopular question (because I'm thrilled to see Roger's music available to the masses once more): How did Human Sacrifice get reissued (with the logo smurfing redesigned, no less!) without any of us being even gently nudged or notified? Who is getting the royalties? Roger Martinez did not simply assume the rights to the debt of VR--he assumed the NAME and THE RIGHTS. We couldn't make the reissues work on our own, because a.) the old label had restructured several times and had no idea where the original contracts were at the time (or at least wanted me to believe this), and b.) Roger could not find his copy, either. No contracts, no "100% legal" reissue. The name "Vengeance Rising" is a copyright of Roger Martinez. He IS Vengeance Rising. And he co-wrote that album; who is getting paid for it? I doubt Doug or Larry are getting anything, either.

Roger would not have authorized this reissue. Even though we don't communicate like we used to, he would have shot me an e-mail over this. Why? Because there's money involved...and also, he had very specific conditions before he agreed to let us try to do it. Roger and I agreed as far back as 2005 that we were going to put the albums back out with comprehensive liner notes, photos, etc., and print T-shirts with the debut album artwork. Even as his publicist and friend, I had to BEG him to even consider this--he's ashamed of everything he did as a Christian artist, and it took a LOT of convincing to persuade him that reissues and T-shirts would be a good idea if he was going to record new music.

And I know it's petty, but I can't help but think how much Roger would smurf poo bricks over them altering his band logo. If this is legit, I'm at a loss.

I guess it sounds like I'm being butthurt about this, and I'm not really--I'm just curious how this happened without any of the creative parties involved, especially after all we went through to get as far we did (only to flounder like some majestic...um...floundering thing).

Oh well. At least the music lives, no?


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Yooooo Stig! its good to see you man.


Thats funny, I asked the same thing about the rights and everything when the intense millenium plans were first being announced on reissuing most of the old Intense catalog. Somebody just said that I should "rest assured" that Roger dosnt own anything. That really sucks and Im ashamed if people are making money without giving roger his share.


But maybe its true....maybe "HE DONT OWN NOTHINGGGGGGGGGGGGGGG"

Stig, you should get ahold of Roxx productions and DMD to get answers to your questions about the VR reissues. I see you stumbled your way back onto the CMR and asked but those are the responsible parties.
Hey man, it's good to have you back.

Pardon my ignorance Stig, are you a former memeber of Vengeance Rising? I'm assuming from your post that you are.

It is my understanding that, many times, artists think they "own" something when in fact it's the former label that actually owns it. Many, many times the artist may own a name or a trademark or a copyright, but the labels own the recordings and can do what they wish with them as long as they own them.

This is precisely why there have been times an artist has re-recorded an album...because the label owns the original recordings and wants a boatload for them...but they don't own the songs/copyrights themselves, which allows the band to re-record them all they want.

No Shawn, Stig was just the PR person for VR.