New York Dolls

Any fans of the New York Dolls out there? Their self title album is a supposed favorite of Gene Simmons and Paul Stanley, love their first album "Trash" "Jetboy" and other classic proto punk classics, featuring Johnny Thunders who was more noted for how badly he played live than anything else, despite their love affair with needles and high heels I thought they wrote some killer tunes that still sound good today, even liked their reunion album from a few years ago ( well only David and Sylvia are alive from the original line up) and it had best song title I heard in years "Take a Good Look at My Good Looks", and cool little singal "Dance like a Monkey" where he declares of his lady friend "Your Design is so intelligent/There aint no way that was accident/come on shake your monkey hips/my pretty little creationist, after all this time Johanson is still wise ass street poet.

I absolutely LOVE the DOLLS....They took the swaggering "F**k You "strut of the stones....wrapped it up in their barfly mama's bar smurf-for-hire garb and peddled out on the dirty streets...preening, sneering and camp as hell. DAVID JOHANSSEN spits out his lyrics and doesn't give a toss if you dig or not...the music was ruddy and haltingly blues groove sifted through rawk & roll...These guys should have been as big as AEROSOMITH...and KISS....

And if you love the DOLLS...dig into the late Boston area ban THUNDERTRAIN!!!!

Priceless Shiney!

The Dolls are to me what Aerosmith is to Ult and Alice Cooper is to Shiney and Spec...

They embody everything i love about rock n' roll, humour, flash, edge, glamour, trash, style etc. And i shamelessly dig so many bands that carry on what the Dolls were all about....well the one's that get it right.

I must say an underrated aspect of them that gets lost behind all the outrageous image and myth are some of the spot on sentiments that pass through Dave Jo's rubber lips....listen to Lonely Planet Boy, Frankenstein, Human Being....those songs kill me everytime.

Their dirty realists who cover themselves in escapist old world glamour.

Man I love these guys haven't listened to them in quite some time gotta break out some Doll's and get my sleaze on

Does anyone else think the riff in "Personaltiy Crisis" sounds like the main riff in "Talk Dirty To Me" by Posion

Shiney wrote:

These guys should have been as big as AEROSOMITH...and KISS....

they probaly would have been just as big if the weren't the most self-destructive band of there time I read the oral-histroy/biography of these guys and
let me tell you they make G'N'R seem like brothers

I was just reading Trash: The Complete New York Dolls and came across this interesting paragraph......

..."It's worth noting that, as the Dolls declined, the third party in the Thau-Leber-Krebs management consortium was seeing his own charges' star rising swiftly and effectively. Aerosmith were basically a sanitised, more radio friendly take on the Dolls shtick - which meant they could appeal to the average denim-clad, Budweiser-swilling rocker without him having to wade into the scary waters of sexual ambiguity. Aerosmith towed the line and their record company, CBS, stood squarley behind them as a result. The Dolls, on the other hand, felt that they were being suppressed by their record company, and ignored by the Leber-Krebs management axis"...


While i don't agree with Aerosmith being a "sanatised take on the Dolls shtick" i do think that the author hammered the nail on the head with this part..."they (Aerosmith) could appeal to the average denim-clad, Budweiser-swilling rocker without him having to wade into the scary waters of sexual ambiguity (unlike the Dolls)".

I think this repeated itself again a decade or so later just substitute Guns N' Roses for Aerosmith and Hanoi Rocks for the New York Dolls, Guns N' Roses drawing on androgyny in their image but not sexually threatening to your straight denim n' leather rocker while Hanoi Rocks had they had a proper chance to break the US music market would have failed because of the same reasons as the Dolls did.

manny wrote:

featuring Johnny Thunders who was more noted for how badly he played live than anything else,

It's true. I saw him solo at the 7th Street entry in MPLS, and he was too drunk to function. I'm not sure he lived long after that.

rattpoison wrote:

I was just reading Trash: The Complete New York Dolls and came across this interesting paragraph......

..."they (Aerosmith) could appeal to the average denim-clad, Budweiser-swilling rocker without him having to wade into the scary waters of sexual ambiguity (unlike the Dolls)".

As one of those beer swilling 70's rockers I say there was some truth to this. My friends and I loved Aerosmith, and weren't really open to the Dolls until after being reconditioned by Punk. That was my experience anyway. I want to qualify this (see below) as not being necessarily about sexual insecurity as much as it was about Aerosmith being one of the great working class bands. We though of the Dolls as being art and Aerosmith as being power. Not that it was either/or or anything.

Were you aware of them at the time? It seemed that they were out there exposed and in the consciousness of the rock kids ready to be taken in especially through music magazines like Creem who featured them quite a bit, but not many got into them. I've read a common scenario a few times where people who bought the record hid it from the friends/peers out of fear of having their sexuality questioned.

Music is so political when your a teenager.................still is!


Still today is confronting......



Much safer option.....

I like this band too, I missed out on them back in the day and I wish I hadn't. I read in magazines over the years where the Dolls were such a big influence on so many bands and musicians that I like that I felt I had to check them out. I was happy that I did. These guys were very innovative for the time. I saw a show about their bass player on HBO some time back and how he was a part of the band for some time then ended up joining the Mormon church. Pretty interesting watching him come from this wild band into a librarian. He was able to get the band back together and play a reunion show that went very well but before anything else came of it he was diagnosed with luekiemia (sp) and passed away a short time later. Pretty sad to say the least. Still a good band with tons of attitude.

I have that on DVD it was called " New York Doll' it was very moving documentary on Arthur " Killer" Kane, he seemed almost child like. It was interesting to think that for years the bassist for the New York Dolls was working at a Mormon church as a librarian, unaware what an impact the New York Dolls had on the punk, metal and alternative rock. At least he got to feel appreciated one last time by his surviving band mates and live audience before he passed away.

manny wrote:

I have that on DVD it was called " New York Doll' it was very moving documentary on Arthur " Killer" Kane, he seemed almost child like. It was interesting to think that for years the bassist for the New York Dolls was working at a Mormon church as a librarian, unaware what an impact the New York Dolls had on the punk, metal and alternative rock. At least he got to feel appreciated one last time by his surviving band mates and live audience before he passed away.

I saw that one too. Great doc. Very sad too.

Quote :

he seemed almost child like.

Do you think he was always like that, or was that the effects of drugs and alcohol?

I am sure it had to do with drugs and alcohol, look at the way they lived, they made Motley Crue look like the Osmonds.

rattpoison wrote:

Were you aware of them at the time? It seemed that they were out there exposed and in the consciousness of the rock kids ready to be taken in especially through music magazines like Creem who featured them quite a bit, but not many got into them. I've read a common scenario a few times where people who bought the record hid it from the friends/peers out of fear of having their sexuality questioned.

Yes, we were aware of them then, and I don't think the issue was really that they were sexually threatening, because we already had Bowie and were soon to embrace Queen. Everybody liked Queen that I knew. It had more to do with their take on the Stones being too familiar at that point,too R&R. I think we compared them more to the Stones than Aerosmith. I think the concept of Aerosmith as a "sanitized Dolls" really was more about the intentions of how they were promoted by managment than the actuality of how they were percieved by punters. Apparently some of the promoters didn't believe in them which hurt them. They didn't get played much on the radio.
The Dolls were heavy in a R&R sort of way; but Aerosmith was more accessible to those of us who were into "Proto-metal". 70's Aerosmith was one of the greatest bands ever, people just liked them on merit, which is nothing against the NY Dolls whatsoever.

The New York Dolls reaked of debauchary, and I have feeling that seeing
the original lineup you had either the expections of a real good show
or a car wreck.

While it is true that David Bowie and Queen were already on the scene
or getting to arrive, you had the feeling that these were stage
personas they would disgard once the show was over, where the New York
Dolls this who they were both on and off stage. I also think they
suffered from bad management who didn't know how to market a band like
the New York Dolls, They certainly made an impact since both Aerosmith
and Kiss cite themselves as major fans.

manny wrote:

The New York Dolls reaked of debauchary, and I have feeling that seeing
the original lineup you had either the expections of a real good show
or a car wreck.

Again, that's a good point. Bowie & Queen always put on professional shows. I never saw the Dolls live, but I did see Johhny Thunders & The Heartbreakers touring their live record in 1980, and it was a disaster. So maybe the Dolls had themselves to blame as much as the insensitivities of the meat and potatos crowd or the miscalculations of managment.

I have their first and the album that came out a few years ago. I can't get into'em.

Just give me "Hot Hot Hot"!

Bumping and moving this...


NEW YORK DOLLS most recent offering (and only their 4th actual studio album) "Cause I Sez So" hit a few weeks ago...It rocks. I liked their last one "One Day It Will...." but it seemed a little lacking, most likely due to the new musicians and lack of building a dynamic as of yet..

However, The DOLLS of 2009 find Ex-HANOI ROCKSter Sammi Yaffa joining the fold with David Johnassen and Sylvain Sylvain...and two new guys I can't remember...It's quite good. Is it on par with their debut material..."F**k No" but what ever could be...It is however a group of old hepcats showing these snot nosed garagey whippersnappers, how you do it.

I only have a compilation album by these guys,...



which I like very much, but never bought any of their studio releases. I should remedy that some day.

I remember when Tower Records was closing their doors, I picked up their last release Some Day It Will Please Us... I had a huge stack of cd's already, so I put it back. D'oh. I could have got it for like $2 bucks. I like that song 'Dance Like a Monkey'.

Shiney wrote:

Bumping and moving this...


NEW YORK DOLLS most recent offering (and only their 4th actual studio album) "Cause I Sez So" hit a few weeks ago...It rocks. I liked their last one "One Day It Will...." but it seemed a little lacking, most likely due to the new musicians and lack of building a dynamic as of yet..

However, The DOLLS of 2009 find Ex-HANOI ROCKSter Sammi Yaffa joining the fold with David Johnassen and Sylvain Sylvain...and two new guys I can't remember...It's quite good. Is it on par with their debut material..."F**k No" but what ever could be...It is however a group of old hepcats showing these snot nosed garagey whippersnappers, how you do it.

I too am lovin' the new Dolls rekkid (Note: Sami was involved in the last one too). Lotta slow burners exploring their r&b roots and some surprising Duane Eddy twang aswell.............cool and different songs which is what their about. Well worth the effort.

I am glad to hear the new album by the New York Dolls is a good listen. I have not heard it yet but I was a fan of their last studio album so I am looking forward to hearing this one as well.